I am dissaponted

December 14, 2008 9:42am CST
Hey my fellow mylotters, I am a bit disappointed, in myself as well. Why do we find it necessary to defend Christianity from people of other religions attacking Christians and the bible. I know I have gone after at least one person who only posted hateful things about Christianity while trying to hide his own beliefs. But do you respond to non-Christians who attack the bible? And do you think there should be different sections for different religions? And lastly why do some Christians attack other religious beliefs and holy books? Does anyone think they can persuade people with saying evil things against their holy books? As for me I am going to stop responding to these people who obviously want to stir up controversy and want an argument so they can turn it around that you are intolerant. Funny why is it that only Christians have to be tolerant?
5 people like this
19 responses
• Norway
14 Dec 08
yes I agree with u no need 4 religion on mylot. we can propagate our religion by other means. even if we try to clear misconceptions yet our fellow mylotters try to spread havoc. peace will miss u on religion.i really liked your philosophical style.
1 person likes this
14 Dec 08
LOL well you are of only a hand full of people who do.
15 Dec 08
I was raised as an Anglican, and still believe that there is a lot of sage advice contained within the Bible. However, due to the school I attended, private English Anglican school, I had my eyes opened by the Reverend who taught us Divinity (Religious Studies/R.E.). We were taught the true roots of the Bible, how it has been completely overhauled and amended to suit the political ambitiona and aims of a few corrupt individuals, how it has been abused to persecute others. Strangely, despite your post, the majority of intolerance on myLot is from Christians. There are many vile, unjustified and fanatical posters who abuse Mohammed daily. I have even been told by Christians on this site that tolerance is not a christian virtue, and that there is no reference to tolerance in Jesus' teachings - I retort by pointing out that Jesus should be judged by his actions as much as his words, and that the phrase "render unto Caesar" reveals Jesus' tolerance of Judea being under Roman administration. You name yourself 'freethinkinagent', but do you examine Christianity with a free and open mind, or just blindly follow dogma? Sts Peter & Paul are the bedrocks of Catholicism, and subsequent Chriatianity, yet neithers gospel fitted the bill for the Popes. St Thomas' Gospel was in the Bible for 350 years, until 1 group of people who never met Jesus nor were visited by angels, excluded him and wrote a whole new fantasy Gospel. The idea that Judas Iscariot betrayed Jesus is ridiculous in the real history. Are you aware that far from paving the way for Jesus, John the Baptist named Simon Magus as his successor, not Jesus - Simon was in Alexandria, and Jesus usurped him in his absence? Jesus had no intention of founding a new faith, he was a Jewish fudamentalist who rallied Jews against the corruption of the Jewish church and monarchy, wanting a return to Moses/Elijah-esque Judaism. Most notable, no-one knows for certain where or when Jesus was born. Almost every theologian and free-thinker accept that he was probably born in Egypt, and that in the 6th century a whole story of his birth was adapted from the Roman God Mithras, and the fact that the Jewish teachings claimed the Messiah would come from a town called Bethlehem (a very common place name in Judea). Even the date of his birth is the feast day of Mithras. The Romans were excellent record keepers (as, incidentally, were the Hittites, who, far from being the barbarians of O.T. propaganda, invented one of the earliest forms of writing, had great culture and architecture), yet the Slaughter of the Innocents would have been carried out Roman troops at the request of Herod, yet no such action is recorded anywhere. The problem lies within Christianity, where blind following is practised, and too many people believe the childish myths of Sunday School lessons without ever looking under the surface. Whilst some Christians attempt to force people to believe that our faith (I assume that you are a Christian too) is the one true faith, but then use such ignorant and well known fraudulent arguments, they will leave themselves and the faith open to be attacked. From my own experience on myLot, there are a great many Muslims who visit this site and who are willing to discuss faith and religion openly and honestly, without reverting to abuse and name calling. I also have noticed 2 other matters; post anything critical of any American President or Christianity and nameless, unidentified myLotters will rapidly dealue your star rating, complain against any posting on any subject you have made, and then target people on your friends list. Tolerance is a virtue that is often missing from some Christians on this site. (Over 500 people left this site in 1 week last year due to this behaviour) I hope this has dispelled some of your concerns and be sure that I shall continue posting fact and information, in the hope of enlightening others and learning from them. I am a Christian, whose religion was formed by a King who decided that, as a monarch, his power should be greater than that of a Pope!
16 Dec 08
I think if you read any of my post you will see how free my mind is. I have studied many years the origins of the Christians faith. And my question was also to Christians who attack others beliefs. And the Mithra worship and belief started way before Rome, it was a Persian tale not Roman. It goes back much much further. It was Constantine who declared the solstice or Saturnalia as the birth of Jesus even though he was born in Aug-Sept.Constantine and his council of Nicea is responsible for much of the way christianity worships today including Easter. The Jews borrowed form all earlier Culture, mainly from the Canaanite, Egyptians, Babylonians and Sumerians. And they did not take the language or letters from the Hittites, the Hittites were not a semitic people, and their language was a Indo-European family closer to Hungarian than to Hebrew. The closest language to the Hebrews that the Hebrews did take from was the Ugarit. A canaanite people.
17 Dec 08
I think maybe you misunderstood my response. I didn't believe you attacked me. And i agree many Christians ideas and beliefs are flawed in what they think is in the bible and how they interpret the bible. The reason I put the problems starting with Islam at that date is because that is when "Christians" mindset about other religions took a different direction. Before that and for a while after that Christians, Muslims and Jews lived in the same cities peacefully. But when the mindset of the church of Rome changed about no Christians was the beginning of problems between the Church and Jews and Muslims. And the 1095 crusade was the beginning but by 1184 the inquisition just really was the nail in the coffin for relations between the Church and Muslims. Saladin was 1138 - 1193 I very much agree that Christians do not really know their bible or its origins, The bible has been deliberately mistranslated in some instances to protect the churches power, but that is not what this post was about. I was trying to get people in the mindset to stop defending what they don't really understand and two stop attacking those they don;t understand. Perhaps you thought I was attacking you, wasn't, I just speak to the point. I could write a book on how the church deliberately mistranslates Genesis alone. So thank you for your response. Hope to hear more from you. Like I said if you have ever read any of my other responses you will see how free thinking i am, even though I do call myself a Christian.
• United States
17 Dec 08
Imagine going into court and having the judge say, "So you think you are a Christian? Well you're a liar!" That wouldn't be to harsh a judgment from any seat of power would it? I've done posts on that subject because I could write a book on Civil Rights violations, supported by the Church leadership and hidden from society or so the silence of the lamb has so prevailed at the moment. There is a counter movement to the injustices that have power and reign over humanity. We move forward now for the sake of peace... For Blessings,
@kerriannc (4282)
• Jamaica
18 Dec 08
While growing up people always say that it is not what you says but how it is said. There are Christians here who come across abrasive and that is not how Christ portrayed his self while on earth. There is nothing wrong in educating others about Christian Faith but it is how you do it. When the doubters were doing there thing Jesus uses humility and alot of us Christians does not have this. Do you remember the story about the lady that was being stoned and Jesus said if there is anyone among you who has no sin cause the first stone and no one could lift a stone. There is another story about healing the sick on the sabbath. We need to display this humility and things will be different. As for heaping hot coals on other religion that is wrong. We can all have good discussions here in Religion if Christians stop judging. The bible says we should leave all judgment to God and this is what is not practicing here. Stop judge and quote the bible verses to back up what is being discuss. Even in prayers we are told to use the bible scriptures because they are God words so this is what should be done while debating or discussing. Happy Holidays
18 Dec 08
Now you got it, Thats what I was looking for above. The best way to show that Jesus is the christ, would be to live a life as you mentioned, that is the best testamony, not reading scripture to someone who desn't think it is real. Your actions are real, if they see your life of love and peace, then that is real then you can tell them why your life is the way it is.
@kerriannc (4282)
• Jamaica
18 Dec 08
Thank you free. This is how I believe that one should be. Display the attributes that Jesus did.
@kerriannc (4282)
• Jamaica
18 Dec 08
I think that this is the reason why Jesus says we should shine our light so that man on earth see it and gloried God who is in heaven. Even in the Christian churches there are trials and temptation and instead of following what is ask of them they do the things that I see happening here. You know it is so wonderful when persons can show love and be peaceful and then when some sees it and this person can attest to it then the soul can be win. MYLOT can be such a wonderful place to win souls if it is down in the correct way.
• India
15 Dec 08
Yes, I agree. No major religion which has survived so many centuries and has such widespread reach, needs to defend itself. However, none of us know in entirety the details of each other’s religions and curiosity sometimes gets the better of us…naïve comments, misinformation, unfounded prejudices make us misconstrue perfectly innocuous lines and turn them into hate-mongers. I have seen this happen here and I know how bad it can get. However, that has not dissuaded me from asking questions and right now, I am reading up Jesus Christ on the net. I have some questions which I am putting forward to you. 1. What religion did the Romans follow at the time of crucifying Jesus? 2. Jesus is said to have been baptized by John the Baptist (wikipaedia)…what does this mean? What religion did John follow and was Jesus baptized into it? 3. On Jesus’ cross the words INRI means that Jesus is referred to as the King of the Jews. Is this true? If indeed, then why this animosity between Christians and Jews? Why a completely separate religion? 4. Do Jews accept Jesus as a prophet?
16 Dec 08
Great I love questions. In Rome around 4B.C. or during the time of Jesus, there was no one religion being practised in Rome. It was a mixture of religions brought to Rome from many different cultures. While they did have their pantheon, they were more of the mindset of a bonding between them and nature verses them and a god. Their gods and goddess though were borrowed form other cultures notably Greek but had other influence as well and in fact they went back to the Sumerians. Even the Emperor himself was a "living god", although this was more a title of obedience to Rome than people actually worshiping him. Through out the empire people had different religious beliefs. Both John and Jesus were practitioners of Jud ism, John began baptising people for the remissions of sins, a symbolic submersion in water to symbolize being washed clean. It is also similar to the scapegoat symbolism used by the priest of Israel, The letters INRI is taken from the Latin words IESVS·NAZARENVS·REX·IVDÆORVM or Jesus of Nazareth King of Judea. Pilot ordered a sign hung above Jesus head on the cross It would have actually been written in three languages. Latin, Greek, and probably Aramaic. The animosity between Christians and Jews really didn't exist until 1184 when the Inquisition began, as a side note this is also when Christians and Islam began to have serious problems. Christianity is really not a religion to itself, at least it was not at first. It was a Jewish cult as it sprang from Judaism. The first century Church before Constantine practised Judaism. They would be call Messianic Jews today. Christianity went a whole new direction after 333A.D. when the Emperor Constantine destroyed true christianity and installed a puppet Church under his power.
• India
16 Dec 08
Thnx for responding. Every time I come across ancient history, I am amazed at how similar peoples' religious beliefs were...the Roman's beliefs were somewhat akin to what Hindus believed then, even to the point of worshipping the King as a reincarnation of God. However, you have not said whether Jews accept Jesus as a prophet.
17 Dec 08
Yes Romans Greeks Egyptians and even Hindus owe their religions to the Sumerians. As for the Jews, If you are speaking of the time of Jesus, Some thought he was a prophet, others a great teacher/rabbi others though him a revolutionary, and a few thought he was the messiah. Today about the same among the Jewish population, Those who believe he is the Messiah are call Messianic Jews.
• United States
14 Dec 08
Well I'll be disappointed if if you stop sharing your knowledge about your Christian beliefs as I have a lot of questions about what makes a Christian different than any other religious belief system that is employed in our world and why they all can't be put under one umbrella. Thinking of John Lennon of course. Our walk should be under one umbrella. Why don't we give peace a chance? I've totally enjoyed our conversations and thank you for your participation. I've shown you the underbelly of the monster that you call Christianity and other Religions. The foundation is built on false pretenses. If the veil is fully lifted you might find that a personal experience is the only quality that matters, as the real truth is often hidden for personal gain. I have so much that I could add with personal experience in my own life, and having any Christian turn away from a good conversation about their own faith or beliefs would be a sin to hide the fact that they do not stand on a solid foundation firm in their convictions. The same can be said for every other religion. Few will take the time to stand up and hold their leaders accountable for the lies that are promoted for profit. Prophetic people do not profit but abused people deserve to be compensated for injuries. Tolerance and intolerance, to tolerate is to allow not to necessarily agree with but to allow to exist. Intolerance is to annihilate or remove from existence. The command of god is to destroy all living things and the command of GOD is to care for all of the Earth and all of the inhabitants. I follow the GOD of Life and Love. I commune with people who care about Life and Love, who openly share with others. Hiding your beliefs is not what we are called to do when we are asked to follow and find GOD. Quite an answer huh??? ;) I hope it is not too complex, certainly not to simple and also quite descriptive. May your quest for knowledge begin... Leading you to; Peace and Blessings, Sincerely, Gary
14 Dec 08
And the meek shall inherit the earth
• United States
14 Dec 08
I so understand that...
18 Dec 08
Re; the meek inheriting. I'm with Monty Python, 'That's nice. I'm glad they're getting something.' Unfortunately, what will be left of the world for them, after mankind has destroyed the planet?
• Belize
14 Dec 08
if we choose to hate so be it, the world is round u know there will be people out there to hate and there will be people out there to support. Its all based on our personal beliefs (isn't that what religion is about?).
18 Dec 08
Too many just decide to hate.
• United States
18 Dec 08
Am I the poster child for that? ;)
• India
14 Dec 08
Its sad that people fight among themselves even the educated people do this and it is a shame on humanity why can't we live with love and peace ?
14 Dec 08
Some people just have a need to always be right, even if they are wrong.
• India
15 Dec 08
you are right
• Philippines
14 Dec 08
Uh oh... I feel like a bad Catholic now. I make fun of my own religion and, odd enough, I usually find myself defending other religion from attacks of my own Church. It´s not that I don´t have fate, I just thought we should respect other religions before we expect them to respect ours. Respect is a thing to be EARNED NOT IMPLORED. Yes, I make fun of my religion. Even the rituals, I don´t practice it because I get bored with it. I read the Bible and I question it. A lot. But I try and do good to other people. It can´t change the world but it can´t also make me a bad Catholic. Religion would probably be the only section that would never end in an argument or discussion. Well, except maybe if people start to accept and respect. It´s not so hard.
14 Dec 08
Questioning ones own beliefs does not make them bad, but helps them grow. If we blindly follow then we are nothing more than cattle. Thanks for your response.
• Philippines
16 Dec 08
Oh well, that´s a fresh point of view.
@060157 (1060)
• Pakistan
14 Dec 08
same goes when people attack Islam. i don't really respond to such discussions either. i can make out a person who is mocking a religion from a person who is asking a question out of curiosity.
14 Dec 08
All religions deserve respect for that person. It does not mater if we agree with it or not. Me shouting at you will not change your mind and me attacking you holy books will only cause you anger. But civil discussion can lead to finding similarities. With respect we would not have so much problems in the world I think
1 person likes this
@060157 (1060)
• Pakistan
14 Dec 08
so rightly said.
• Tunisia
18 Dec 08
don't be desappointed , great religions can't be affected by non polite people blasphems, My god bless you!
18 Dec 08
Thanks for your responce. You certainly have a mature way of looking at life.
• India
15 Dec 08
The people who do not have the capacity to understand other religion will adopt such practices. Those who respect other religions are having good knowledge. Practicing Tolerence is a must for all persons irrespective their faith.
18 Dec 08
Thanks couldn't agree more
@Ravenladyj (22992)
• United States
15 Dec 08
And do you think there should be different sections for different religions? Absolutely NOT...I think that one section for all religions is just fine actually...There isnt any need to seperate them...that IMO would just encourge the troublemakers to create more trouble...Those of us who are openminded and mature are very capable of conversing about various religions without the nonsense.. And lastly why do some Christians attack other religious beliefs and holy books? I honestly believe its out of fear and doubt....Generally when someone attacks another person either verbally or physically its becaues they feel threatened in some way and they fear what that other person represents etc etc whether justified or not... Do I attack others? No...not at all...I will defend myself when beign attacked and I will readily point contradictions out or voice my opinion which to some may seem like an attack but its not...
18 Dec 08
Thankyou so much for your contrabution to this discussion. I think there is room for all even the non-beleivers in discuaaions on religon, as long as it is kept respectful. Thanx
• United States
15 Dec 08
Some tough questions here, but I am willing to try to explain my beliefs. We usually will defend ourselves when attacked, either physically or verbally, so when Christians are attacked concerning their religion and their bible, they will defend their religion and bible. Mainly because their belief in Jesus Christ is a part of who they are and take the attack personally. Do not believers of other religions to like-wise? I had tried to respond and defend my beliefs, but I came across a couple of Islamic men that not matter what was said, they were always right and you were wrong, period, end of discussion. I quit responding to such because their minds were made up and the whole purpose was just to attack and not learn. So, I quit wasting my time and efforts. Different sections for different religions? Here on myLot? Or am I missing your point? I wish that all attacks on any religion would cease. Discuss respectfully the different religions is ok, just don't put any religion down. I think that those Christians that attack other religions and their holy books have mis-interpretted Jesus' command to the disciples to go and spread the good news of the messiah. I am not sure, but I think that even Paul says that we should spread the good news of God's love. The commandment did not say to attack other religious beliefs, but to tell of God's love.
18 Dec 08
Tough? Naw you did great! Thanks for your imput, And you have a good idea of how to respond to people.
@violeta_va (4842)
• Australia
15 Dec 08
My religion (christian orthodox) teaches me that I should respect my religion and the religions of others and that I cant be a true Christian if I dont. I am told to respect every person on this planet and every religius teaching, book, place of worhip (I am sure that is not how you spell it). We say it in our prayer God please help an remember all people present here and their families, all memebers of our chirch, our mother land, and all people all over the world. If someone atacks my religion and I KNOW that what they are saying is wrong I will defend it but I also will defend other religions if I know what the person is saying is wrong.
18 Dec 08
Thanks I have not heard of Christian Orthadox. I will have to do some studing.
@sid556 (31018)
• United States
15 Dec 08
I actually don't think that anyone should defend any beliefs as we are all entitled to believe or not believe what we want when it comes to things such as religion. Also no one should be attacking anyone for their personal religious or non-religious beliefs. When it comes to this sort of thing, there really is no right or wrong. It is not wrong for people not to believe in the bible and it isn't wrong for those that do. Both sides feel very strongly in their beliefs and neither is going to change the other person's viewpoint. As for rules on such discussions, I don't think that'd be right either. Some people are just interested in learning about other peoples views and are able to discuss differing opinions in a civil manner.
18 Dec 08
Thanks Sid, El-Sid wish more were like you.
• China
15 Dec 08
first of all i am a non-believer.i don't believe gods really exsit.and i don't think religion belief is a bad thing.i respect them.the same,non blievers need respect too.why some bad guys forced others believe what they believe??
15 Dec 08
Absolutely agree. If you are a non believer and you tell a person of faith that you do not wish to hear them, they have no right to force you to Liston or try to convert you.
@Erssyl (617)
• Philippines
15 Dec 08
I will not be disappointed at all.Because when I know that the discussion is about other religious discussion I will not continue reading it.When I watch television and I feel not good with their discussion,it is very easy for me to switch channels.Sometimes I read and listen too.When I feel I like.But as long as they are not enforcing it to me I cannot and will not disappoint myself.
15 Dec 08
A very mature point of view, thanks
@barehugs (8992)
• Canada
14 Dec 08
As a one-time Christian who gave it up 50 years ago, I also have wondered why Christians bother to defend their faith. No Christian would bother defending his/her College degree, for example. I'm wondering if a defensive Christian may feel a bit insecure in his/her Faith? As for an explanation of posted hate, this is unforgivable! Every person is entitled to his/her own personal beliefs, and no one has the right to refute that. I do not respond to hate-filled posts. My Forte is Love sweet Love! My dictionary defines tolerance as," the capacity of enduring hardship or inconvenience without complaint." The way I see it, everyone regardless of Faith, or Creed, should practice Tolerance. It just seems like the right thing to do!
14 Dec 08
If only more of us were like you
@aringwi (136)
• China
15 Dec 08
the Christians are tolerant because they are limited by the beliefs and regulations and laws ,they can't do sth that is against the standard of the religion.the common is also limited by sth else which is the moral and the social laws.if they are against it,they will be punished by it and be sent to the prison.