What are they thinking?

@dfollin (12744)
United States
January 6, 2009 10:22am CST
The mother of my son's child took him to court yesterday,not even in the jurisdiction that she lives in for child support.He already provided the medical insurance for her,paid for a lot of her child care expenses,diapers,wipes,food,clothes for her.The judge said yesterday that he has to pay $650 a month,plus keep providing the medical. And she has no expenses! She lives with her mother,pays no rent and only some food.She shares a car with her dad who pays the car payment,taxes,insurance and most of the gas.Also when my son has his daughter he has to provide the diapers,wipes and food. He has to move by the end of this month.Work is slow,so he does not make as much money.And as we all know that the food prices and everything else has gone up.He has to keep paying for both auto and medical insurance for himself.Plus,in about 2 months she is going to have another baby with her new boyfriend and won't be working,therefore she will not have any child care expenses anymore. What was the judge thinking? Does anyone else have a story like this one?
6 people like this
21 responses
• United States
7 Jan 09
12.00 dollars an hour here in pa seems like pretty decent money to me. Your son will be moving at the end of the month...will he move in with you? 480.00 a week before taxes...gas is only what 1.79 here? So thats what 1920.00 a month before taxes? and he has no other children...no wife to support..just himself...hmmm... He may pay for medical insurance and diapers etc but that is called parenting. When you have a baby it costs money. He only has the child every other weekend so he is noy providing most of her support except monetarily. The mom gets to lug around the car seat and diaper bag, be awake all night with teeting, and arrange for a sitter (be it you or whoever since you charge to babysit your grandchild)....Maybe if you want your son to pay less you could give him back his money when she pays it to you?
2 people like this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
Well $12.00 is not much at all around here and he works 12 to 13 hours a day. Ok,lugging the car seat around and diaper bag is a part of parenting too.He did have her every other week,but she put the stop to that because she was told by a social worker that if she had the baby more she could get more money.I cannot afford to give him back money because she would drop her to me and say that she was going to work and go out running around,spending money and then not pay me. And as far as me charging to babysit my grandchild.......Do you work for free? I only charge them a third of what any other day care will charge.And I babysit hours and days that a daycare won't.They need someone to do that,so I am at home to care for her,but I need an income.It still is their respondsability to pay for childcare while they work.During other times she is just here with grandma.Like tommorow while her mother is at the OB for a check up for the baby she is pregnant with that IS NOT my grandchild!
@bam001 (941)
• United States
6 Jan 09
I think the judge is right in this one. While the mother may not have expenses, she does provide housing/shelter for the child. I realize that she doesn't have to pay for shelter, but she did find a way to provide it. In the past, your son should have paid child support instead of the child care expenses, diapers, wipes, food and clothes. This way it would have been well-documented that he was providing support for his child. If his income will decrease (from what the judge based the payment on), he should have addressed that with the judge in court. I know this will not be your popular answer, but your son chose to have a child with this woman and he should be responsible for part of his child's support.
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
6 Jan 09
We did keep receipts and log of who paid what for what.This girl has a history of him giving her money and then she says that he did not give it to her and she can't pay for child care or she had no money for formula and so on.That is why he bought the stuff instead.Plus she just recently started driving.
@Bebs08 (10689)
• United States
7 Jan 09
Oh that is really hard. Unfair!!! I am also wondering why the judge has that kind of decision? Huge child support every month? well, i don't hear of something similar to this. I heard of some who gave child support but not that big. I heard of $350 to $450 but not that much? $650? I know how hard is the economic situation of everyone else today and that is really hard. It is pretty much annoying.
@ebsharer (5518)
• United States
6 Jan 09
I have seen it happen plenty of times. I also live it. My husband pays a lot for his kids. (A LOT) A few things to tell your son. 1. Make sure he keeps EVERY receipt spent on that child. I would recommed if he goes to the store to buy diapers and a video game (or what ever) pay for it seperate to have 2 receipts! 2. Don't give her ANY cash! 3. Send her home in the clothing she came in (washed of course) 4. If there are ever any marks that are "odd" or out of place take a picture. ALSO if some thing happens for example She is one years old and starting to walk - she falls down and scraps her knee - take a picture put a note on the back saying first boo boo on the knee. That way if the ex ever says she came home with scrapes and bruses he can say yes and this is what happened! With proof of what the "injury" was. 5. keep a journal or day planner of EVERYTHING Who picked up who dropped off? What time? Was the person on time? Any phone text email converstaions. did "sara" come over and not have a clean diaper on? did the ex cancel a weekend? did the ex chage a weekend? did you change a weekend - and WHY. (this can come to your advantage when the ex says well he couldn't take her on jan 12th - and he can say yes judge shes right i couldn't because my mom was in the hospital or i had an emergency at work.) and any thing else that concers the child should be on paper. Some thing you and your son have to realize is it doesn't matter what the parents expenses are the noncustodal parent is responseable to provide HALF of the care of the child. The child should be able to live a life as if it had both parents in the same house. I'm not being rude beilive me I understand my husbands child support blows the 650 out of the water. I could only pray thats all we paid! A judge can take up to 49% of a paycheck for ONE child!!! If your son gets fired of laid off he can appeal the cost of the child support. I have seen many men and women acutally quit there job take a low paying job appeal the support for a lower cost then once a new cost is ordered get a hirer paying job. Child support is usually not looked over for 2 to 3 years and even then they only ask you if you want to change rates. If you need it done before then its a longer process and can be more complicated. But most of the time if you are honestly making less then when the order was set you will win. About the medical - if his job doesn't provide medical then he may not have to carry it. Tell him to talk to his case worker about that. We not only pay child support every month but we also pay for all expenses while they are at our house. When school time comes around we buy school clothing for one (mom buys the other child) we switch kids every year because one is more expensive then the other. We buy all the school supplies for both every year. We pay for birthday parties and more. We also keep every receipt to show that what we are putting out aside from child support it helps to be able to show that. Hope my suggestions help I'm sorry your son has to go through this its a HARD situation!
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
6 Jan 09
Thanks for all the hints.We already do a lot of those things.I kept a log when I was babysitting her before.Before the mother pulled the same stunt she has quite a few times.She doesn't show up with her or call and let me know she got a new sitter.After court yesterday she asked me to keep a log. We kept receipts.But now he has to send $650 to the courts.Where in turn they send it to the childs mother.The judge told her that she had to pay me with money orders only and that my son is to never give her cash! Previously we did take pictures of her boo boo's. 49% ! That's a lot!
1 person likes this
@ebsharer (5518)
• United States
6 Jan 09
48% is for one kid my husband has 2 kids!! Guess what they can take for that up to 62% of his check!!! They take about 60% of his check its pretty horriable.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
6 Jan 09
Wow!That's terrible.Where's this at?
1 person likes this
• United States
6 Jan 09
No what the judge looked at was how much it takes to raise a child in this day and age. As a parent I have to say that for one child 650 a month is pretty good for child support. Not to mention the money is not for the mother its for the upkeep of the child. As a grandparent I would hope that your only concern is for your grandchilds well being. If your son feels that she is not using the money appropiatly he can pettion the court for an audit on where the child support is being spent and she would have to provide reciepts showing where and how she spent the money each month. If they find that she is not spending the money on the child they will assign a gaurdian at liedem to see to it that the childs best interest is always watched out for. Good luck to him and all that he has to deal with. I hope that for the sake of the child he continues to do what is right for his child.
1 person likes this
@ebsharer (5518)
• United States
6 Jan 09
Most child support comes on a credit card now. Its like a debit card - you have a pin and every month the money is put on the card. This keeps track of EVERY purchase. It works like a bank account and keeps track of all transactions just like a bank card does! Its a great thing - we have asked that my exs accounts be looked over - more then once.
1 person likes this
• United States
6 Jan 09
Your so lucky to have that. In colorado its all about the checks and the cash. I wish my x had to account for all the money he spent. Would have made my life so much easier.
1 person likes this
• India
6 Jan 09
i thtry to make her understand u need to understand what she what exactely want by u and in which area her mind work
1 person likes this
@camomom (7536)
• United States
7 Jan 09
Unfortunately, that's how the laws and judges are these days. My fiance went through the same thing. It didn't end until he took her to court to even out the custody arrangement. He was paying that much and never seeing his son because she wouldn't let him. Very long story but now he has the most custody and pays no child support. She also has to work now.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
Cool.Good for him.My son used to have his daughter every other week.Then she put a stop too it.Said she missed her,then soon after that I found out that she had been talking to a social worker that had told her that if she kept the daughter more,she would get more money.
@camomom (7536)
• United States
8 Jan 09
That's terrible. He has his son every other week and every day after school now. It started with every other weekend then every other week.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
10 Jan 09
good.My son used to have her every other week.Then the childs mother put a stop to it.Now it is every other weekend.
@camodad (176)
• United States
7 Jan 09
I have been in this "exact" situation. My ex lived at home, daddy paid for everything (still does), she didn't work, didn't have bills, etc etc. The worst part is that I was in North Carolina in the Marines at the time. She left and brought him 400+ miles away. Had I known the law about moving out of state I would have stopped her. Anyway, I was paying $488 every month, plus medical. My son was on state assistance but I still paid the medical per order. Once I moved back up and started seeing my son more I was taking her back and forth to support hearings never changing much. Finally we started with 50/50 custody. I have him one week she has him the next. I got support down to about 200 a month. Then I found out she got a job. Waited a month so to know that she had enough time to make some money. She lied, I got screwed. She tried moving further away making me drive 45minutes one way to get him to school. Custody battles began. After about a year of going to custody battle then support then custody then support....you get the point. She knew what needed to be done to stay out of court and finally did the right thing. She is very cautious as to what she does now with him because she knows I will take her to court. It is very stressful. The whole thing. Your son needs to stick it out and do what he can to wake her up.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
He used to have her every other week.Then she would not let him do that anymore,because she found out that she could get more money out of him.When they went to court the judge said no you will get her every other weekend,courts make the decissions not the parents.
@camodad (176)
• United States
8 Jan 09
That sucks. Here the judge tries to get the parents to come to an agreement. He wants the child to have both parents the way it should be. I'm sorry things are not working out. Make sure your son calls everyday to talk to his child. The more he annoys the mother the easier things can get.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
Yes,he was just on the phone talking to her.Then he was talking to me and said that the mother is supposed to see the baby later today.
@slickcut (8141)
• United States
7 Jan 09
That seems to be very expensive child support for one child as i see it...The medical expenses is normal procedure here in Texas but usually for one child here it is usually around 200.00 a month ..Maybe at the time he was in court he had a higher paying job,but i think he should go back to court & see if he can have it reduced some,that does seem quite high for one child...If he cannot come up with that amount of money ,they will put him in jail and then he will be in a mess...I think they should only charge an amount that he is able to pay..My daughter is married to a man that has a 3 year old by a past g/f...He does supply medical but he only pays like 150.00 a month ,according to his income....
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
No,this was just yesterday and he has the same job he has had for a while.Wow,only $150? I was supposed to get $110 a month and only got it one time for my oldest son.It was court ordered for my youngest son's father to pay $225 and medical when my son was 3.I did not get the $225 till he was 16 and never any medical.
@slickcut (8141)
• United States
8 Jan 09
Its very hard to get some men to pay child support..In your case you should have took your ex back to court over & over again..As for your son? that price is unreasonable & he may could hire a lawyer to get that amount cut back, it wouldn't hurt to try.Some of those judges hold personal grudges from the past...
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
10 Jan 09
I did try to take him back to court and they told me after I would file the papers that my income (my husbands) was too high to raise my ex's support.
@angelia286 (2029)
• Singapore
6 Jan 09
Well, money does in fact makes the world goes round. That's a fact of life. *Shrugs* Oh well~ Usually, the law would side with the mother more than the father. The courts sympathizes with the mother but not with the father. One would never understand what the other party is going through unless they have been through the same situation themselves. No doubt your son is paying for all those things that you have just mentioned, and his ex-wife isn't, but then coming to think about it, your son has a choice, doesn't he? He can choose to do the same as his ex-wife, but he chose not to? You, as a mother will of course side with your own son, but on the female's side, her mother will probably side with her own daughter as well by saying that her daughter is using time to take care of the child which your son isn't. At the same time, because of this time used to take care of the child, she will have no income at all (like what you have just mentioned as well). So in the female's mother point of view, her daughter is at a losing end, but on your point of view, your son is on the losing end. I will put it in a scenerio like this: What if your son is the one who has to take care of the child, and not his ex-wife? Your son will not be able to work anymore, and will have to survive on the $650 provided by his ex-wife, and pay for everything for the child. What do you think now? Lol. Anyway, I am just playing the devil's advocate here. Please do not be offended. Oh well~ I would have to say that I do not have a story like this, but I see these sort of things happening all the time around me. Like I say, we will have to place ourselves in other's shoes before understanding what they are going through too. Take care and happy mylotting!!
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
6 Jan 09
But that is not the case.The judge said that he has to pay her the child care money because she drop's her off to me.It used to be that he had her one week and she had her the alternate.Then when she was told by a social worker then she can get more money by putting a stop to that.She took her and said he could only have her every other weekend.He was going to take her to court for custody but he couldn't get it because he does not have 2 bedrooms.He cannot afford it now. Just after they got an apartment,she left him so she wouldn't have to help pay the rent.So,he was left for that expense for 6 months,the length of the lease.She is moving in with her new boyfriend and will not have to pay expenses.She is living with her mom now and hasn't been paying expenses.And her dad pays for her auto expenses as well as her cell phone.Even when she is not working she drop's the baby off to me and then doesn't pick her up till the next day when it was only supposed to be for a few hours.Then she tries to get me mad at my son telling me that he was supposed to pick her up. No,I would not take her side if she were my daughter.She used to drop her off a lot to her grandmothers house.Right now her other child stays there 24/7 Monday thru Friday.And in a few months she is having another baby with her new boyfriend.
• Singapore
7 Jan 09
Now that sounds horrible! Is there even such a person living on Earth? Sorry to say this, but what does your son see in her in the very first place to even want to marry her? That's kind of unfair to you too as you are the one who ended up looking after the grandkid and she gets to enjoy herself out there with her boyfriend, but yet, she is the one getting all the cash. She's really one cunning girl! Sorry for my initial post as i did not get the full story. Thanks for clearing the issue up with me!
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
7 Jan 09
Yes,unfortunatly there is such a person on earth! That's what I asked my son.He said he is trying to keep his family together because he grew up with out his father and mother living in the same home. She is cunning! And it is unfair to me and the baby.Because she will go thru these time's where she will not let me or the father see her for as much as 5 weeks at a time.I'll be watching her and then one morning she will not show up or call.I won't hear from her for weeks!
@ANTIQUELADY (36489)
• United States
10 Jan 09
seems like they really stick it to some men who don't deserve it. i can't believe the amounts women get now. when i divorced my son's dad he paid me $40 a month. of course that's been a long time ago but that wouldn't even feed a child.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
10 Jan 09
I was only awarded $110 a month for my oldest son and only got it for 1 month.I was awarded $225 a month for the son I am speaking of,$225 a month plus medical when he was 3.I didn't get money till he was 16 and never any medical.
1 person likes this
@ANTIQUELADY (36489)
• United States
10 Jan 09
some of them get by w/murdere like mine $ 40 a month didn't go far. to heck w/him. we made it.
1 person likes this
@seabeauty (1480)
• United States
24 Jan 09
She is very lucky to get $650 per month for one child. My ex husband makes 73,000 a year before taxes and he only pays me 400 for 2 kids. It was not court ordered. he is paying me what he feels he can. If she is going to be staying home with the kids then she doesn't need that much. I agree what was the judge thinking.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
24 Jan 09
It's worse than that he has to pay $735 per month.I got look at the court order.
• United States
8 Jan 09
some judges seem to automatically grant a raise no matter what. i know a guy paying for 8 kids-$400 each. he had to get a second minimum wage job just to cover his expenses. as soon as the ex caught wind of it,she was back in court asking for more. the judge didn't care if that made him homeless.
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
I know someone who had a full time job,evening job and another one on the weekend to pay child support for 2 kids.He never gets to see the kids because he had to move so far away so he could get a room that he could afford.Plus he was working so much also.
@kenzie45230 (3560)
• United States
7 Jan 09
That's what it costs. My husband pays that much in child support too. It doesn't matter what the mother does or doesn't do financially. He owes that much each and every month - plus her medical insurance, plus half of any medical bills, plus half of her extra activities - like soccer, dance, whatever.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
I thought it was that way too,but when when I had my daughter and her father,my fiance moved in with us they took the medicade away from my boys,even thou he was not their father and said that he had to provide the medical for them.Even thou,my youngest son's father had a court order that was not enforced saying that he had to provide medical.That was when my youngest son was 13 and the court order took place when he was 3.We had got no money or the medical.Then when he was 16 I finally got the $225 a month,but still no medical.I was married then and my husband had got medical for both my son's by then.I was not working.I was home.A year later I tried to get the child support raised and was told no that my income was too high.When I explained that I had no income and he still had not provided medical.I was told that my husbands income counted as mine and if he was giving my son medical that that's our respondsability.
@kprofgames (3018)
• United States
7 Jan 09
I think that happens a lot Dfollin and I get tired of hearing about it. I know of several woman - not young girls mind you - woman that have had several children by different men all because they want to rack up the child support dollars. It isn't fair. I know the judge is going off the "national" numbers in term of income to come to the amount of child support awarded, but really. I don't understand why people keep popping out these babies to collect funds just to sit at home and pop out more babies. No, not everyone is like that. Some mothers never even get the child support that is awarded to them. I understand that, but what you are saying is very true. Here you have a devoted father that gives to his child and he's getting screwed. There is an importance of supporting your children. Your son is doing that, but it just seems like he's being taken advantage of.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
Yes,my son does not want to be like his dad.His dad was supposed to pay me $225 a month and give our son medical.I did not get the $225 till my son was 16 and this was awarded when he was 3.He never got the medical.For my oldest son I was only awarded $110 a month and only got it 1 month. Yes this girl is popping them out.Has 2 and going to have another in a few months.
@Pachello (16)
• Belgium
7 Jan 09
That's just absurd! I would file a complaint, I don't know how but I'd find a way to file a complaint about this. It seems your son is paying for everything in her life, which is simply unfair. I do think it's responsible for a father to take care of his son, financially, but paying for his ex her car insurance? Absurd.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
8 Jan 09
No,it is unfair and yes he is paying for everything.You misunderstood thou my son has to pay his own car insurance in order to keep his job. Her father pays her car insurance.She has no personal bills.Someone is paying for each of them.
@sid556 (31005)
• United States
7 Jan 09
Well, my story is quite the opposite really. I am a single mom and I was very close to my dad. I see the importance of the father being in a child's life. Last year I dropped all child support committment for my daughter's dad in exchange for him being there for her while I worked. We work opposite shifts and he would realistically be able to do this. I work 2nd shift on weekends and he works days during the week. She is 14 and so does not really need a sitter but needs guidance more than ever. Also, he hadn't been spending much time with her and I thought maybe the little push would do them both some good. It did until the ink was dry on the court papers. Now...he does not pay support and also very rarely sees her. It's all pretty sad. I know I could take him back to court but it is about more than the money. My daughter and I just deal with it. your son's ex ought to be more appreciative. I don't understand the judges either. I have daughter's from a previous marriage and the judge always let him slide easily on his support.He would get thousands behind and he only had to pay 80.00 per week. He worked under the table and they could not prove his income. At one point he was in jail and they dropped his obligation altogether and once he got out they set it at 25.00 per month...yup you read that right...because "he needed time to get on his feet".!! in the meantime, I was raising 3 kids with no help. you gotta wonder about our judicial system sometimes.
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
7 Jan 09
$25 ! My son was having her every other week and then she put a stop to it. He works 12-13 hours and sometimes takes on double shifts when he does not have his daughter.Her mother would call me and ask me if I had the baby at times that he would go out and get mad because he would go out and leave the baby with me.But,there are and were many times where she would tell me she had to go to work and leave the baby with me and she would be out instead.
@celticeagle (118280)
• Boise, Idaho
6 Jan 09
People are amazing! She may just want to get back at him. Or maybe she wants to make his life horrid. Who knows! I am sorry to hear about it none the less. If he is consistent and keeps the CS office update on his situation it will help. I knew a women when I was young that kept marrying and having babies. She was on welfare and her check went up as she continued to have more kids.The kids were sadly neglected. Amazing!
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
7 Jan 09
I think she is trying to make my life miserable for him,she always has.There is no such thing as him being consistent they have garnished his wages,like he has a past of not being consistent.He has always provided for his daughter,a lot more then she has. I knew people who kept having babies to stay on welfare too.
@stephcjh (32328)
• United States
6 Jan 09
I know this feeling but it is just the opposite for me. I am the mother of my daughter and her father does not have to provide anything for her at all other than $50 a week. He does nothing else but he gets to claim her on his taxes every other year and makes a killing doing so. He never sees her and she is almost 17 years old now. That is not fair!
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
6 Jan 09
No that is not fair.Why does he get to claim her on his taxes? For my oldest son I was only awarded $110 a month!He paid it one month and they never tried to find him after that.
@Thoroughrob (11750)
• United States
6 Jan 09
That is bad. Does your son have a great job, when he is working fall his hours. I would appeal it with a lawyer. It sounds very unfair. At least for the wages and things paid around here. My husband worked with a guy that his ex took him back to court all the time. He bought a motorcycle and she told him that if he had money to buy a motorcycle, he had more money for his kids. He was making $15 an hour. When she got done with him, he was working for a $60 paycheck a week. The man lived with his parents, because he could not afford rent. That is so wrong, that a judge would do that to a person.
1 person likes this
@dfollin (12744)
• United States
6 Jan 09
Wow! $60 a week That is not good. My son make's $12 an hour.Then by the time they take out taxes,social security,medicade tax and the insurance payment that does not leave much.Plus they have been cutting back work and he has to move.
@terri0824 (4991)
• United States
6 Jan 09
Sorry to hear about this. I don't have any story to share here. The judge apparently didn't look at the whole picture, and only looked at her side and not his. That is a lot of child support to be paying. I raised my two daughters without any support beside at best a month of $195 for two children of SSI since their father was disabled. And then when he had another child, it went drastically lower than that split between 3 children.
1 person likes this