Was there a link between Hitler and holocaust?

@vandana7 (68473)
India
August 31, 2009 5:13am CST
I have seen many German documentaries, and post World War II movies. I have read many books on holocaust, including Leon Uris' Mila 18, and QB VII. I admit I was touched and I feared Germans for quite a while after that as I read these books when I was young. But in retrospect, I think Hitler was just a stooge. There is nothing that linked him to the concentration camps. If he was so keen on this, we would have seen documentaries of him visiting the concentration camps, kicking and hitting the jews, killing a few himself, and getting a perverted pleasure from physicality of it. I may, of course, be wrong as there may not have been any survivor from the camps he visited. But I would definitely like somebody to come up with some links that have a record that states that Hitler ordered in writing those exterminations. He may have been prejudiced against the jews, but planning and ordering such thing, I doubt he did that. He appears like a mad man to me whenever he is shown on Discovery Channel. So I doubt if anybody would have followed his orders like that. Was it a propaganda created to malign the defeated leader, or were the real psychopaths working right under his nose, doing what they wanted and blaming it on him? Do u ever question history like that? What is ur call on this? And if possible can u give me some link that shows Hitler ordered those exterminations, and that he visited those camps.
4 responses
@thea09 (18327)
• Greece
31 Aug 09
Hi Vandana, Hitler was most definitely aware of what was going on but was extremely careful to be behind the scenes, his intent was the destruction of the Jewish race as outlined in his extreme anti semetic views, but no he was not the one who carried out or organised the atrocities but the people who did so had his permission and back up and were close to him. His main concern was the progress of the war and his successful rabble rousing appealed to the masses of unemployed who needed something to blame for the economic plight so were manipulated into rising against the Jews. In this regard of focusing a nation onto a common enemy of Jews Hitler was most successful but he could not openly support the ensuing policies as he needed the support of the general army, as well as the SS, and the army leaders did not support Hitler's obsession with wiping out Jews, so in order to maintain the army loyalty any involvement with the fate of the Jews was played out low key. The main stategist in the execution of the plan against the Jews was Adolf Eichmann who was in charge of the massive plan to move the Jews around to ghettos then camps. As the actual war progressed Hitler distanced himself from the camp situation as more and more needed the army support and was probably aware that this was one area he should distance himself from if he was ever brought to trial.I think your perception of Hitler as a madman is totally wrong, he was an ignorant but very shrewd man who was determined to control his country by any means and his own anti semitism was very real and he channeled that to manipulate the implementation of his policies. There is no need to see footage of Hitler in a concentration camp to know that he gave full support to them behind the scenes.
@vandana7 (68473)
• India
1 Sep 09
Thank u for ur time thea. I too think Hitler was not innocent. But I wanted to get it with facts. Sorry if it disturbs u.
@thea09 (18327)
• Greece
1 Sep 09
Also the books you cite as your reference are actually fictional works and whilst Uris was a good writer and used factual information in his novels ,but that is what they were. It is very dangerous to promote revisionism because you have not read the correct material to substanitate real facts but it is good that you take an interest in this area of Western history. However there have been many attempts before to discredit even the existence of the concentration camps and it is sickening to give credence to revisionism in this area. The proof is there.
@thea09 (18327)
• Greece
29 Sep 09
There has been no response to this beyond again the argument placed elsewhere that Hitler was unaware of concentration camps as you have seen no footage of his appearance there. I cannot understand why you wish to promote revisionism on a subject you have clearly not studied. I find it very disturbing.
@anklesmash (1416)
3 Jun 10
Hitler was no stooge for a few reasons 1 just because he never put his name to the orders dosent mean he wasnt aware of what occured and if he didn't approve it would not have happened. 2 High level nazis including the ones that orchestrated the holocaust showed a great deal of initiative,hitler was a hands off ruler and they acted in a way they believed hitler would have approved along lines that Hitler set out.
@vandana7 (68473)
• India
8 Jun 10
Am I glad to see this discussion activated once more. First - let me answer stine's first response. Normal people were not shown the atrocities. It was an hush hush affair. Even those who knew or could see something wrong was happening with periodic imprisonment of jews were not reacting because they were afraid of Nazis, and Gestapo. So I would never say all Germans are bad, to be afraid for self and family is not equal to being bad! There is a world of difference between Guantanamo Bay prisoners and concentration camps and ghettos. Jews are inclined to save monies and become wealthy. Over a period this leads to subconscious jealousies. That is what Hitler possibly felt. Unlike it, Guantanamo Bay is some place to get information to safeguard national security and to identify the terrorists. Please dont get me wrong. I am not Hitler's advocate. I am just a believer in justice. I believe there is in every case an irrefutable bit of argument. Until that is reached, the truth is not really out. I believe we have not reached that here because there is no physical evidence linking Hitler to jews extermination and that argument has something to do with it. I believe if we search for truth in such cases we can find the right solution to such mass exterminations. War propaganda is strange thing. Historians often belong to the countries that win the war. Wars are often fought on some belief. Afterwards the winner realizes that the belief was not totally true. Then it becomes necessary to portray the loser in bad light. I also think technology in those days was not as advanced as it is today. So communication was an issue. I think it was wrong on part of allied nations to have participated in Olympics held in Gernmany around Hitler's era. Surely, they were getting reports about jews extermination! If that is far fetched, then so is Hitler's knowledge about extermination camps is far fetched.
@vandana7 (68473)
• India
9 Jun 10
That is exactly what I wanted to shut down! It is necessary to have a conclusive condemnation - I mean there should be no doubts what so ever! 500 years down the lane, they may find something in possession of somebody and then question our ways of thinking right and wrong. Then he might be hailed as martyr, and all that went along with him might be replayed which is not very desirable as you and me know. That is the reason a conclusive concrete link - if not physical - by irrefutable logics should be established. Just because somebody said Bush was wrong about something didnt make everybody join the bandwagon, did it? Same thing hereto. And many people who think like that are not coming out in open, which is more dangerous. So now we have time at our disposal, information links, and people who may have relatives who have narrated the truth to them. Earlier this information was scattered. Hope you understand stine what I am getting at. And I also think that when we have a punishment or condemnation - it should prove as a deterrant and a precedent. We've had ample massacres similar to what Hitler did. We dont really want that again, do we? Polpot didnt suffer at all - even though he was as horrendous as Hitler. We've the Rwanda, and the Serbs. All this after Hitler. We need to recognize symptoms - whether it is psychophancy, or greed of leaders, or other arms bending methods that are used before such speeches that incite people psychologically start coming in. And senility of leaders who resort to such methods need to be questioned at International levels, and nipped in bud! Stop trading with them the way we did with Saddam. I wanted to analyze that. But apparently I didnt express myself well enough. Of course, I am not for wrong. I am for truth, justice, and perpetual solution to these type of problems, we need to learn from our mistakes, dont you think?
@taztheone (1726)
• India
1 Sep 09
Hitler was indeed a mad man, Mad for political power, Mad against Jews which he thought was the main reason for the world war1. He was extremely angry against Jews, communists & many others. You can go here to get the complete history & info about Hitler & all his related history http://www.auschwitz.dk/Hitler.htm I think this will give you a clear picture of the history.
@vandana7 (68473)
• India
1 Sep 09
Hi taztheone, thanks for the link. :-) Can u read the post above. It is too long to retype. :(
@bhanusb (5709)
• India
31 Aug 09
Hitler was definitely a cruel dictator. Thousands of Jews were killed by his direct order. Many Jews were killed by the German Generals without the knowledge of Hitler. Hitlar's cruelty were not shown properly in movies.You rightly said, he was pictured as a stootge.