I learned all my parenting skills on soap operas

@dawnald (85129)
Shingle Springs, California
October 29, 2009 11:09am CST
Well not really... Yesterday - James, you will be really fascinated by this - on Y&R, Abby found out that her parents are divorcing. All her mom would tell her was that it didn't work out. That's when my Dearra, she's not opinionated, really, said, "oh come on! Kids aren't stupid! Tell her the truth." And she and I got into this discussion about what divorcing parents should and should not tell their kids. She was for full disclosure, whereas I don't believe in confusing kids with adult business. By that, I don't mean you should lie to your kids. I just don't believe you should be telling them things that 1) they aren't mature enough to handle or 2) that trashes the other parent. Well, Dearra didn't buy argument #1 (try telling a 12 year old that she isn't mature enough to handle something lol), but I think she bought #2. What do you think?
8 people like this
16 responses
@Chey1970 (1186)
• United States
29 Oct 09
Being divorced and having 3 kids from my first marriage. We told them straight up that being husband and wife wasn't working for us, and that it had nothing to do with them. We wasn't going to lie to them. We even gave them the option in which parent they wanted to live with. This way worked out well for us, not saying it will for all.
2 people like this
• United States
29 Oct 09
I agree with the Ideals, I have a problem with putting the Ideal into action when there is a veil over the truth, like a mountain of dirt swept under the carpet and the people responsible for the dirt are not willing to clean up their mess. I know I have enough of my own stuff to deal with that I can't be responsible for the behaviors of other people, but I certainly can expose how filthy they are when it comes to a lack of communication and a lack of cooperation. Standing up for Chey and her point it sounds like she is a very level headed person having to live through a difficult situation where she and her ex. they no longer got along and they amicably split... As you Dawn and Chey have both pointed out this is not a perfect world and not all relationships break up smoothly... I guess I rolled an unlucky number when I couldn't even clear my name of the accusations of conduct and speech of another individual. I don't know how I could be more clear with the exception of not understanding how to make people hear what I have been through as a result of people who lie... Proof can be found in my blog, that it is not limited to what I say but also what I have written... Anyone interested in a link?
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
I've read your blog, but if Chey's interested she can find it on your profile, right?
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
Which is kinda sorta exactly my point more or less. Tell them the truth but they don't need to know all the gory details.
@Fulltank (2882)
• Philippines
29 Oct 09
Divorce is not legal here in the Philippines. The church are against it and still there are many conservative Filipinos who opposes it. But legal separation is allowed and have to go through a lot of scrutinizing by the court before you actually get separated. So much for that. When parents are into situations like divorce or separation or any other major act that would affect the lives of the entire family, it would be appropriate that the children who be involve in the discussion. No matter how young our children, they still have their feelings and as parents, its our responsible to tell them whats going on. They may not understand it but still they can react and express their feelings.
2 people like this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
You have to tell them what's going on to a point, but not every little detail.
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
Of course.
1 person likes this
@Fulltank (2882)
• Philippines
29 Oct 09
Yes, but still in their young minds, they knew that its still separation and would end them up living with only one parent at a time.
2 people like this
@James72 (26790)
• Australia
29 Oct 09
Yep, you've reeled me in hook, line and sinker on this one Dawn! I'm so enthralled that I need a few minutes to compose myself..... Ok..... You have one smart kid there, let me tell you! Time and time again I'm impressed by the way she looks at life. Age isn't necessarily a driving factor, but maturity level is paramount! Not all 12 year olds could handle full disclosure, but Dearra sure as heck isn't one of the ones that need to be sheltered too much from the realities of a situation by the looks of it! The main thing here is that even "full disclosure" can be appropriately positioned with a child and your own Daughter has proven this to be the case right off the bat. There's no set method here! Number 2 is an absolute given though and I'm glad she bought that one! I know from first hand experience how much damage spouse trashing can do and children are confused enough about coming to grips with divorce as it is without having to be manipulated negatively like this as well! The bottom line is that communication needs to be flowing. The worst thing of all is when families retract into themselves and aren't open with each other. No one wins when that happens.
2 people like this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
I'm impressed by her! So many people split up and get all caught up in the emotions and feelings of betrayal and want to just stick it to the other person. And then they wonder why we have so many screwed up people in this world.
@ElicBxn (63194)
• United States
29 Oct 09
It depends on why the parents are divorcing. Was one of them unfaithful? People divorce for many different reasons and a 12 yr old can understand a number of them. A lot better than we might've back when we were 12. So, I think that there are reasons you can share with a tweenie or a teen that we might not've been able to understand. Heck, there are times when people get divorces that don't really understand why they are doing it anyway.
1 person likes this
@ElicBxn (63194)
• United States
29 Oct 09
See, I think a 12 yr old could've understood... Well, your dad has done some things I just can't live with any more, and so we are divorcing.
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
yeah although then you'd be dealing with "what was it?" and so on...
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@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
Well in the soap opera, for a change, it didn't have to do with infidelity. The father did a lot of sneaky manipulative crap and people got hurt. The mom didn't want to bad mouth him, but then it all came out in a magazine expose. But that's a soap opera for you...
1 person likes this
@laydee (12798)
• Philippines
30 Oct 09
I don't think a full disclosure about this is good for the kids because if parents aren't mature enough how much more for the kids? Regardless the age, immaturity will always be a factor. Like for example, now that I'm quite older, my mom actually told me that she felt my dad has an affair. Regardless how old I was, I didn't get it and started getting angry at him and all sorts. It even aggravated the problem so to speak. I don't think whatever soap operas do cannot, in any way, be applied in present situations because these are for entertainment purposes.
2 people like this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
30 Oct 09
Soap operas are so totally improbable, no they aren't good examples. I agree with you, full disclosure isn't appropriate, but some version of the truth that the child is mature enough to handle should be shared with them. Otherwise they're either going to be obsessing that the whole thing is their fault or they will be totally disgusted with the parents for not being honest with them.
@cynthiann (18602)
• Jamaica
29 Oct 09
I do not believe in trashing th other parent at all. When my son's GF of !@ years threw him from their home as she had fallen in love with someone else it was so catastrophic for him. Their daughter will be 9 this December and is a very well adjusted little girl. Her mother was always praised for being the best mother in the world and she was told that although Mum my and Daddy cared for each other and loved her so very much they did not want to live together. She was 4 and very confused for a while. But that has passed and she s loves the twins and my DIL. all is well now and her parents are friends too. She knows that she can always count on her Daddy to be there for her (and her GM!) My point is that children actually know what is going on in a marriage and when it comes to the fore they are sometimes relieved. It is the anxiety of not knowing the situation that is so stressful to them. They would need to know also how they are being looked after and what the visiting arrangements are etc. Children do sense tension and it bothers them so much.
2 people like this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
Children have enough to go through in a divorce without having to deal with "Mommy says Daddy is a bad person". But they certainly do pick up on tension and so on.
@gabs8513 (48686)
• United Kingdom
30 Oct 09
My Children where 15 and 18 when I got divorced, but not knowing at the time, they had heard a lot specially my son and he said it was about time I got out of it But I suppose you just explain as you can but without all the Details as you say
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
30 Oct 09
Kids hear things and even if they don't, they pick up on expressions and so on.
@royal52gens (5488)
• United States
2 Nov 09
I am of the mind that the children only need to know what they can handle at the time. A 5 year old will not understand the same things a 19 year old will. Each situation is different. There are no right answers.
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
2 Nov 09
Knowing your kids and respect. I guess that's what it comes down to.
@jillhill (37354)
• United States
29 Oct 09
When I got a divorce I didn't tell my kids too much..just that we didn't love each other and I never ditzed the low self serving b#stard once. Didn't need to ....they figured it out on their own. I think keeping everyone calm and in as normal of a routine as you can will help with the seperation etc...
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
Of course they figured it out on their own. Children are smart. lol But good for you for not trashing him to them.
@zed_k4 (17589)
• Singapore
30 Oct 09
That's cool; how you interact with your child. I think kids nowadays are smart, and they can sniff something's amiss with their parents even without them telling something's wrong. The best way is to communicate with them gently, both together, and then one by one. It's definitely not easy, but it's better to make sure they hear the truth from the parents mouth rather than from others or especially from them detecting it by themselves.
1 person likes this
@zed_k4 (17589)
• Singapore
2 Nov 09
It's hard being a parent, for sure.. Remind me next time, aite Dawn..
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
30 Oct 09
If they detect it by themselves and we don't talk about it, they are liable to come to some wrong conclusions that might end up hurting them!
1 person likes this
• United States
30 Oct 09
I think like Dearra does....kids arent dumb and they can usually see right through all your efforts... I am generally on the side of telling the truth...to a point...you can tell the truth and not tell ALL of the gory details... Just saying it didnt work out is not really much of an explanation after all.
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
30 Oct 09
Yeah, not much of an explanation. They could have done better than that!
@paula27661 (15811)
• Australia
30 Oct 09
Dearra is a clever girl I see. I do think telling kids the truth is the best thing to do and I agree that how much detail you give them depends on their age and personality and no, trashing the other person is definitely wrong; if you insult a child’s father, for example, you are insulting the child. I know at 12 they think that they are there, they know all there is to know (LOL) In my own family my parents did not divorce but did have severe financial hardships which resulted in the family emigrating to Australia and at the time my mum and dad did not ever make me aware that we did not have any money to even buy food sometimes and I wish they had told me; I don’t mean burden me with financial details but at least explain to me that I did not have many things because we had little money and not because they were just mean! Communication with kids is paramount, keep it age appropriate but be open with them; that’s my opinion.
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
30 Oct 09
12 year olds definitely think they know everything and are so opinionated. I get a kick out of it, really...
1 person likes this
@debrakcarey (19887)
• United States
31 Oct 09
I'm for telling the truth...within reason. You don't tell a four year old what you'd tell a 12 year old. AND you never try to make it all the other parent's fault. Heck, I was in my thirties and still reeling from some of the things my mother tried to make me believe about my dad. And my dad, as wise as he was...never hid his disgust of my mother from me. It tore me up. In the end, I do think honesty still is the best policy. And above all, respect for the CHILD and his/her feelings. Sure wish my kids ex's could learn this. My grandkids would be much happier.
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
2 Nov 09
Yeah, I'm sure they would. :-(
• United States
29 Oct 09
This is a really tough question, and I don't think it has a universal answer. I think a lot of it depends on the particular situation. Maturity level of the children definitely plays a part, as does not trash talking the other other parent. However, there are some situations that might not be appropriate for the children to know about, but that they might find out about from an outside source, so it is better for them to be explained in a kind and loving environment rather than overhearing hurtful remarks from outsiders. Once such situation that springs to mind is infidelity, especially when the offending partner was not discrete about the affair. The children, especially school-aged children, should have some understanding of the situation before they overhear other kids discussing it on the playground or whatever.
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
Maturity level definitely. You aren't going to tell a 4 year old the same thing you would tell a 12 year old.
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
30 Oct 09
No, I agree with you on the infidelity thing. If it was discreet, why cause the children pain by telling them.
• United States
30 Oct 09
You absolutely wouldn't tell a four year old the same thing as you would a twelve year old, unless the twelve year old only had the maturity of a four year old. I personally don't think that children should be told about infidelity if it can be avoided, because that is not something that they need to know. Unfortunately, my oldest daughter had a friend that went through a similar situation, and the friend found out about the infidelity from classmates rather than the parents, which only hurt her more. The break-up was hard enough, but finding out that everyone knew about the affair but her was even worse, because she felt like her parents didn't trust her enough to tell her the truth. In that case, I think that the parents should have come as close to full disclosure as possible, especially since she obviously was going to find out anyway. In other cases where the affair is more discrete and hardly anyone knows, though, I think that those type of things should not be part of what you tell the children. That is just my opinion, however, and I could be very wrong.
1 person likes this
• Australia
29 Oct 09
Although I have never been in the situation myself, I have been very close to many who have been through it. I believe that in every situation the FIRST consideration must be the emotional future of the children, and this depends on their having a healthy respect for BOTH parents. The "happiest"(?) divorces or separations I know are ones where the parents are the best of friends. I can't say I understand how they can be best of friends but can't bear to live under the same roof, but it works with a number of couples I know - and their children are happy and well adjusted. Where the parents remain at loggerheads, the children have enormous problems. The truth? Yes, children should be told the truth, but they don't need to know all the tiniest details of the truth. A couple whose first concern is for the children will take time and patience to ensure that what they tell the children is factual but expressed in such a way as to minimise all harm. (I know of two couples who spent long hours determining how to do this - and ended up convincing themselves that things were not as bad as they had thought, talked a bit more, made a few decisions and promises, and decided to keep going - and are now happy again)
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
That last result would certainly be ideal. Of course, in a soap opera they change partners so often it's dizzying and the fictitious children are left to deal with it!
• United States
29 Oct 09
By telling the truth in today's society's standards you would be guilty of trashing the other parent. I watched Dr. Phil yesterday and he had this couple on the wife was coerced into embellishing a report of abuse many months after her partner had left the house, he was then convicted of abuse he didn't commit and spent 10 months in jail. After jail he got out and they got back together... How familiar is this story? Wow! So here is the thing, the woman is guilty of the crime of filing a false report it is a felony and she is a liar. It is good that the couple in this particular show didn't have children, but what is wrong with the truth when you do have children. Such a situation as I have been through is so similar except I am a father of two and instead of my wife filing the false report, she only signed a lie but then is guilty of embellishing the truth on a regular basis to the point that the last time we split up it was because of deception... If I remain silent it is like an elephant in the room and no one can talk about it because the children are both old enough and know what happened although they might have questions or be influenced by more lies conjured up by their mother to paint me as a bad man... Talk about getting put out in the cold... But then it seems to be the curse of my family and the bullies that are controlling those that I love and me... As a result I am prevented from being the father and grandson that I am. So what happened to my mail?
1 person likes this
@dawnald (85129)
• Shingle Springs, California
29 Oct 09
You can tell the truth to a point. But the last thing the children need in a divorce is to hear one parent tearing the other parent apart. PO lose another one of your letters?
1 person likes this