10 year old refuses to say pledge of allegence

United States
November 17, 2009 2:53pm CST
I'd post a link but I can't copy and paste. Anyway a ten year old in Arakansas has refused to say the pledge on the grounds that liberty and justice for all is a lie. He says it doesn't apply to gays and lesbians. I say right on kid!
3 people like this
14 responses
@speakeasy (4215)
• United States
17 Nov 09
I think it might help if someone explained to the boy that the pledge of allegience is a set of "goals" that we are trying to achieve and the pledge is a reminder to people of what we are trying to achieve. If you look a human rights in the US, starting with the founding our our country, you will see that even though we have not yet achieved our "goals" we have been getting a lot closer to them. He should say the Pledge of Allegience to remind himself each day of what we are trying to achieve in this country and then do what he can to help achieve those goals.
2 people like this
• United States
17 Nov 09
But would that really be taking a stand like he's trying to do?
@laglen (19782)
• United States
17 Nov 09
speakeasy - I think that was VERY well put. I really can't see a legitimate argument to that!
1 person likes this
@debrakcarey (19924)
• United States
18 Nov 09
“I pledge allegiance” (I promise to be true) “to the flag” (to the symbol of our country) “of the United States of America” (each state that has joined to make our country) “and to the Republic” (a republic is a country where the people choose others to make laws for them -- the government is “of, by and for” the people) “for which it stands,” (the flag means the country) “one nation” (a single country) “under God,” (the people believe in a supreme being) “indivisible,” (the country cannot be split into parts) “with Liberty and Justice” (with freedom and fairness) “for all.” (for each person in the country...you and me!) The pledge says you are promising to be true to the United States of America! While I admire your opinion that this is a set of goals, that is not exactly what the definition of a pledge of allegiance means. And I do see where this boy should not be made to say it if he does not believe it, one has to wonder how a ten year old could make that decision for himself.
@kelly10 (678)
18 Nov 09
I can't believe that a 10 year old child would refuse to say the pledge of allegence, or anything else for that matter, because it doesn't apply to gays and lesbians. Surely this opinion has been forced on to him from a higher authority, most probably his parents/guardians. I know that kids are growing up quick nowadays and no more than a child their age did 20 years ago, but I just can't believe that this would really be high on their agenda anywhere. Anyone else agree?
1 person likes this
@Taskr36 (13925)
• United States
17 Nov 09
Meh, kids should say it in school, but if he doesn't want to, there's no point in forcing him. I personally don't see any lack of liberty or justice for gays and lesbians based on the definitions of those words, but whatever.
• United States
17 Nov 09
Because they have been denied the most basic rights. If I had kids they wouldn't say the pledge because of the word God. I think since not everyone believes in god that the word should be taken out of the pledge.
1 person likes this
@laglen (19782)
• United States
17 Nov 09
kitten - what BASIC rights are they lacking? Human rights are "basic rights and freedoms to which all humans are entitled."[1] Examples of rights and freedoms which have come to be commonly thought of as human rights include civil and political rights, such as the right to life and liberty, freedom of expression, and equality before the law; and economic, social and cultural rights, including the right to participate in culture, the right to food, the right to work, and the right to education.
@Latrivia (2889)
• United States
18 Nov 09
"and equality before the law... the right to work." These two are the basic rights they aren't allowed.
@Latrivia (2889)
• United States
17 Nov 09
Heh, that's funny, now I wonder if they're going to force him to say it anyway. I say, he makes a great stand (even though I wonder if his parents are behind it). It's true, though - 'liberty and justice for all' is a lie. Not just because of gays and lesbians, but for all of us.
@Taskr36 (13925)
• United States
17 Nov 09
I agree that there is not liberty and justice for all. A child rapist was allowed to flee the country because he (Roman Polanski) is a movie director. Charlie Rengel, Tim Geithner, and Tom Daschle are all proof of how there is no justice when the rich and well connected don't pay their taxes.
• United States
17 Nov 09
They can't force him to say it. It would infringe his constitutional rights if they did
@Latrivia (2889)
• United States
17 Nov 09
That hasn't stopped schools from forcing students to do things that violate their first amendment rights, anyway.
@mommyboo (13198)
• United States
18 Nov 09
I don't think you can be forced to say the pledge (any more than ANYBODY ought to be forced to worship Obama or sing any songs praising him but that's another issue) or penalized because you refuse. I also know that if you choose not to say 'under God' that isn't grounds for punishment either. I agree with this kid, if he feels that there is not liberty and justice for all because of inequalities, more power to him. He is actually right. I don't think this country is even moving in the direction of liberty and justice for all any more either - unless you are illegal or a citizen of another country, in Obama's back pocket, or bought and sold by the media. Kudos. I support him. The kid I mean.
@debrakcarey (19924)
• United States
18 Nov 09
I tend to agree with you too.
• United States
18 Nov 09
I agree with you mommyboo, but we wake up each morning without fear of being made slaves and we can each choose what our profession should be and lots of other priveledges like that in comparison to the people in darfur where kids are made to be soldiers I think we ought to give atleast some credit to out government
@mommyboo (13198)
• United States
25 Nov 09
Ok Jey, that much is true. However, I would never choose to live (nor remain in such a hateful place) where I had to worry about slavery or being forced to do anything, nor would I allow such atrocities to happen to my kids. You should also remember that we have paid for the freedoms we do have dearly - with the loss of lives in our military. Unfortunately, with the socialist leanings of this administration, a lot of the freedoms we have come to count on are being severely tested....
@lazerm (480)
• United States
18 Nov 09
whats this punk protesting anyway? in iran or north korea if he protested for gay rights at any age, his throat would be cut or he would thrown in a gas chamber. here in the usa, land of the slave-home of the coward, he's lauded.if he really wants to help gays, he should protest the international bankers- rockefellers, rothchilds ,globalists- the ones who control obama. these satanic globalists are the ones who are planning on exterminating gays and lesbians anyway.
@debrakcarey (19924)
• United States
19 Nov 09
I wouldn't call this young man a punk. But I am surprised that others in this dicussion haven't called you to task for your views on the lefts real agenda you speak of here. What most fail to realize...what the government gives, the government can take away. Today it is the conservative who is on the 'enemies of the state' list...tomorrow is another day.
@debrakcarey (19924)
• United States
18 Nov 09
He doesn't have to say it if he doesn't want to. But the school doesn't have to allow him to be a student there either. One does have to wonder why a ten year old would have such concerns. I have raised five children and have 13 grandchildren and they just did not think like that on their own. I homeschooled my children...and they heard a lot about what I thought and what others thought about things as we read the local newspaper each day. We discussed current events....and they'd not have made this leap of abstract thought at age ten.
@mommyboo (13198)
• United States
25 Nov 09
Some kids are amazingly in touch with higher thinking at younger ages, especially ones who maybe have very political parents or parents who introduce them to thinking and deciding about things that affect kids - like liberty and justice and what the pledge means. I shield my daughter from politics because most of it makes me VERY angry, but she has started to form her own opinions about some things that affect her because she sees how I deal with them. I personally have no problem with the pledge - she says it at her school and I say it too, but I also believe that people have the right to NOT say it, or NOT say a part, a word, a section, if that's what they want to do. We are not supposed to be threatened or coerced into doing things, saying things, believing things we do not want to. Especially if it goes against our own personal morals.
• United States
18 Nov 09
This sounds like another case of Parents trying to live through their kids. Another Balloon Boy.
@ronnyb (6125)
• Jamaica
18 Nov 09
Wow a precocious child I would say he has the same right to his views as onyone else.I am not a champion for gay righst or anything but I believe everyone has the right to their views irrespective of age and he has expressed his.No one should force but allow him to speak his mind .I think thi scoudl be the making of a great man especially if these views were coined by him
@sizzle3000 (3040)
• United States
18 Nov 09
Okay I may be in the wrong to say this but at this time I don't care. I do not see where a ten year old needs to know about these things. He's a kid. Has the world gone so low to the point that a child can't be a child, they have to know the world issues and have a stand immediately. Don't get me wrong the stand is a good one but why did it have to come from a ten year old. It's the age that's bothering me. It's just such a young age.
• United States
18 Nov 09
From the mouths of babes the truth shall be told....
@sid556 (31006)
• United States
18 Nov 09
Well, he is a pretty smart little 10 year old and he is so right.
• Malaysia
18 Nov 09
He must have his reasons. He could be a little bit precocious, I think. What I like about him is he can stand his ground. Three cheers for him!
• United States
18 Nov 09
I agree with him why have liberty and justice for all on there its clearly not being flowed every person should have the right to do what they plaec as long as its not hurting no one or them self it makes me mad when people bring the 10 commants in this its like who cares if people are gay if it is worng and God don't like it let him dell with it i don't thing he need hour help. i don't care if people are gay or not just as long as no one id hurting kids or other for no reson then i'm fine.