The Truth about Creation????
By bird123
@bird123 (10632)
United States
August 27, 2011 1:16am CST
Everyone has their version about creation. Let's take a look deeper into the subject. Holy books have creation simple. God creates it--Poof! That's it. Where are all the real details?? Maybe I want to understand more than Poof!
First, we must try to grasp the intelligence and intellectual capabilities behind creation. We must attempt to understand and think in that way ourselves. Let's open our minds and widen our views in this attempt.
One with high intelligence would not create single things one at a time. That's too much useless work when a single action can do it all. Example: a seed will grow into a giant tree starting from a single point. Pretty smart I would say.
With a bang, God created the universe to unfold into what we have today and still unfolding. Pretty remarkable. Is there any evidence to show this?? You bet! Let's examine that. First, the expansion of the universe tells us this is a moving, changing universe. Nothing stays the same. Next, the concrete evidence of evolution. If you were to create everything from a single point, evolution, the branching off of things to become others things, would have to be a part of that. Next, comes the evidence of fractal geometry. Things seem to be in mathematical generating forms in everything. A system made to unfold would have to be orderly and not random. Things that appear random today exist only because they are not understood yet. Science is discovering factals in everything. Is there any more evidence??? There is always more. A statistcal scientist did some heavy calculations and determined that the universe did not have the time since it's creation to form random on it's own. This should tell those who think evolution is everything that there is more to the story. This same scientist said that it was possible if the universe was set up like a giant computer program. Now wouldn't an unfolding universe have to have such a system??? I think so.
The beauty of creation extends beyond our vision. Since mankind discovers more pieces of the puzzle everday, it's clear God added one miraculous thing about it. Mankind would be able to figure it all out in time. Got to teach those kiddies.
So what do you think? Yes, with the depth of the knowledge, there is going to be many more glorious details in the future. I can't wait.
Finally, it seems religion works so much on feelings and emotions around God. Clearly, we can see there is an intellectual part we can share as well. The more we learn; the more we understand; the closer we get to God and understanding how God really is and thinks.
God made it so easy. All the secrets of the universe surround us all. All we must do is Discover!!
This discussion is about the physical only. We are spiritual beings in our true natures. That is an entirely different story.
2 people like this
5 responses
@_sketch_ (5742)
• United States
30 Aug 11
I do not believe that the universe is random either, but this doesn't mean that God created it. That's not proof of anything. It would actually make more sense that God would create in a not-so-structured pattern since he can do whatever he wants.
Secondly, evolution has nothing to do with how things came to be. I don't know why people always think this. Evolution is not the opposite of creation. Creation would void evolution, if it is as the Bible explains it, but they are entirely different things. Creation speaks on how things got here; evolution speaks on how things change into others.
On a side note, I find the idea of a non-physical god who thinks to be very interesting, since thoughts are the product of the brain, which is physical. And even more interesting the fact that most people seem to think that only something human-like could be intelligent.
@bird123 (10632)
• United States
30 Aug 11
Sketch_. Are thoughts really a product of the brain???? We are all spiritual beings in our true natures. I have direct experience to this. These physical bodies are not who we really are. They are our transportation as well as the connection that keeps us in this physical realm. Talk with the very youngest of people for they can tell the difference. The longer we are in this physical world the easier it becomes to be seduced into thinking that is all there is. There is one thing you are right about. The connection between the spirit and the physical body is in the brain. smilingjack. good comments indeed there is intelligence that far exceeds mankind. It's mankind's ego that places him so high on the scale yet there is more unknown than known. We ants will have to work on that.
@_sketch_ (5742)
• United States
30 Aug 11
@smilingjack I disagree with your view that the universe is chaotic. Think of science and math. The universe doesn't go against these things. It's perfectly set up. It's humans that are chaotic. lol.
And yes I know what bird's point was about God using evolution, but if we are going by the Bible, then they cancel each other out.
There are many animals who are smarter than humans, but this is not what I was really referring to. We tend to equate "intelligence" with "mind" and I disagree. Same with "consciousness". I guess there just aren't enough words in language for me to easily explain what I mean. People get so caught up in the words that they miss what I am trying to get across.
What I meant was that people assume that anything "intelligent" enough to create the universe must be some sort of human-like being like God. It's hard for people to fathom a universe that is, itself, intelligent. No, it doesn't have a brain to think. It has no IQ. But is there any real reason to assume that it cannot do things methodically? I see none.
@bird123 I do believe that we are spiritual beings and that our physical bodies are not who we really are, however, I do not believe that our thoughts are who we are. Yes, I do believe that thoughts are a product of the brain. Identification with our thoughts is the very cause of most of our problems as humans. This is ego.
@bird123 (10632)
• United States
31 Aug 11
smilingjack, MESS???? look again. It's a Masterpiece. This is part of the understanding you need to discover. Look deeper beyond the surface. It does all add up. A high IQ design takes a lot of work to understand sometimes.
_sketch_. I must agree with language. Sometimes it's hard to get out just what we mean. God's system in many ways is running itself. I can understand how one might see intelligence at work. Can we really blame thoughts on the brain?? Ego is an important part. It is part of our individuality. In time, one learns to understand and chooses to become beyond the petty things of mankind. All this is the reason for this physical world. Causal universe is needed to teach us exactly what our actions and choices mean. This is the road to wisdom and understanding.
@Chiang_Mai_boy (3882)
• Thailand
27 Aug 11
The whole problem with this is that you ask us to accept the reality of a single creation when no evidence exists to support the concept. On the contrary there is some evidence that the big bang that resulted in this universe was just one of a continuing series of events that have resulted in a multitude of universes.
You quote the work of a statistical scientist to advance your idea but do name him so we have no way to review your source.
Your statement; "All the secrets of the universe surround us all. All we must do is Discover!! is sound but why do we need to begin a journey of discovery with the assumption of the presence of a god or gods. Why not begin with a clear deck and proceed to see if what we discover gives any indication that there is a supernatural element involved or whether there is evidence that indicates we are here in this wonderous place as the result of forces that can be understood without the need for supernatural intervention.
@bird123 (10632)
• United States
27 Aug 11
Chiang_Mai_boy. I'm fine with anyone searching to discover what is, as long as they are open to all possibilities. One must be willing to discover truth whether they agree with that truth or not. If you will do this, having a hunger to discover, I have no doubt you will choose to investigate God at some point. As I have said before, science will discover God before religion will. Smilingjack, sorry your are so tired. Get some rest. It will all be OK!
@PointlessQuestions (15397)
• United States
28 Aug 11
@ Bird, I like your statement that science will discover God before religion will. I feel there is a LOT of truth in that. I can't stand religiosity... I love God, but can't stand religion. I think of the genetic codes that make every living thing on this planet what it is and I just am in awe of God.
@bird123 (10632)
• United States
28 Aug 11
Yes,pointlessquestions. I know this world takes all kinds. I do question why some people refuse to allow for even the possibility that God exists when there is so much evidence around. The evidence of intelligence in all things stares us all in the face. As for genetic codes, there will be even more doors of complexity that mankind will open in the future. God's knowledge runs much deeper than they realize. It is all exciting. I am in awe of God as well. Oh yes, your name, pointlessquestions, doesn't really fit. No question is pointless. Further, I'm willing to bet your questions are often followed by much thought from those you ask.
@1hopefulman (45123)
• Canada
11 Sep 11
There are people that want to know all the ins and outs of how an automobile functions. They enjoy taking the engine apart and putting it back together, while others just enjoy driving one. There are different people with different interests.
God presents creation in a simple way for most of us to have a basic idea. Those who want to know more, study and research and find joy in discovering. I see nothing wrong with either.
The Genesis account is simple and missing a lot of details that we can discover as we grow in knowledge and understanding.
I see science filling in the missing details. They make a theory and at times adjust the theory as more details are uncovered and understood better.
We are always learning and that is part of the joy of life!
@bird123 (10632)
• United States
11 Sep 11
You do make a good point. For a child not capable of understanding all the concepts of creation, what else can one do but tell a good story. A some point shouldn't a child learn and grow to desire to understand rather than be content with stories?? Like you said. It is a choice each will make for themselves. In time, we will all grow up in spite of how we might fight to stay children. Even taking babysteps, we travel some distance given enough time.
1 person likes this
@starsailover (7829)
• Mexico
29 Aug 11
Hi bird: I think both parts have a reason. I am a Catholic and I believe in God of course but I don't think there must be a dispute between knowledge and my beliefs. In my personal opinion I think that the creation theory that we have learnt from the Bible is complete so that's the time where science should give us some extra answers. It's a complement and I don't think it's less beautiful if God created us through a scientist process like evolution.
ALVARO
@bird123 (10632)
• United States
30 Aug 11
Indeed, there are a lot more details left to uncover. I could never be one satisfied with stories. I must have all the juicy details. Who knows maybe after eons upon eons of learning that God will allow me to make a universe of my own. I am watching very close. Hmmm??? Just how did God do that??????? I'm going to figure it out!!
@francesca5 (1344)
•
27 Aug 11
hello bird1,2,3
the problem here really is that all the creation myth in genesis really proves is that for several thousand years a creation myth has existed.
but beyond that it neither proves nor disproves anything. and its existent is consistent with other metaphorical stories from the greek myths, etc, as our ancestors were fond of such storytelling techniques.
@bird123 (10632)
• United States
27 Aug 11
OK!! That's what I'm talking about. Far too many people accept a good story and that's it. Further,like stowyk said that story will change with each telling unless they write it down in a holy book. Of course, religion hates to change but at some point we must all change or we ignore new facts that always come along to surprise us all. Francesca5 is right. We must always strive to discover the facts before any good story.
