Why oh why is English so confusing..

@vandana7 (98826)
India
September 6, 2012 11:44pm CST
I read the usage "good grief". How can grief ever be good? Why is it that you all have such confusing combinations, fat chance, thin chance, which funnily mean the same, but really..we the non-native English speaking communities do get lost at times. lol Honestly, thank you all for improving my language. I was reading some of my old discussions and I found I have improved in my expression. Just that some of the expressions really lead me astray. lol As far as I know there are no confusing expressions in my native language. Care to share any from your language?
9 people like this
32 responses
• Philippines
7 Sep 12
I remember when I was a kid and someone told me "what's up?", I was like I really didn't know how to answer that! I felt like I knew what it means and I thought maybe it means literally what's up there but I'm not really sure so I didn't answer it. I always always get confused in English.
1 person likes this
• Philippines
7 Sep 12
Me too. Whenever I talk to American friends and I can't understand a phrase or an expression, I just always refer to urbandictionary.
1 person likes this
• Indonesia
7 Sep 12
OMG.. I found this is so hilarious Actually - I was like you very much. I was like thinking - ummm were they kidding at me? I was about to answer : roof? But then urban dictionary . com helped me so much on understanding slang and idiom
• Indonesia
7 Sep 12
Yes - but it went so hard when I was watching a movie , titled smart people and carnage ... They talked a lot - and they talked too many idioms , I was feel like giving up
@deazil (4723)
• United States
8 Sep 12
Hi, Vandana, Holy mackerel! What a discussion. I'm glad I just got a brand spanking new tower for my computer. Now I'm happy as a clam. I just thought I would add my 2 cents and chew the fat for awhile. I looked for my cat but she was a gone goose. My neighbors won the lottery now they're living high on the hog. Well, I think I'll go wet my whistle and then hit the hay.
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
8 Sep 12
Yeah..why does mackerel have to be holy, and brand spanking jesus..lol what does it mean if you can tell me.. Happy as a clam..how do we know clams are happy.. and chewing fat..lol gone goose..I can identify those idioms but honestly you do need to explain those expressions to poor us.. High on the hog..lol wet my whistle, hit the hay.. Deazil..that is superb..you had me in splits..
@deazil (4723)
• United States
8 Sep 12
Well, then I am very happy. I'm so glad you liked it. My intention was to bring a smile to your face. Well, holy mackerel is said to have been a reference to poor Irish Catholic immigrants (c.1800) who ate fish on Friday - namely mackerel because it was cheap. Brand spanking new is from the doctors traditionally "spanking" a newborn to start it breathing. Happy as a clam is actually only the first part. It's really happy as a clam at high tide. Since clams can only be harvested at low tide (in New England where I live, don't know about elsewhere) they are happy & safe at high tide. I believe this is an old New England expression as I have heard it used many times by native Mainers. My .02 was originally 2 bits and came from poker playing "put your 2 bits in". This is much debated and there are many other suggestions as to the origin. Chew the fat means talking about unimportant things, as your mouth is going, and it's said to come from the Inuit people who would chew whale blubber to pass the time while doing other things, as it took quite a while for the blubber to dissolve. This also has other theories behind it. Gone goose is simply someone/something that has run away. No idea where it came from. High on the hog - this is where the best meat is. The wealthy would eat that and servants would be stuck with the feet and other lower body parts. Living high on the hog = you're rich! Wet my whistle = get a drink, the word "whistle" has been used (so I read) to describe the mouth or throat for a long time, appearing in literature as far back as the late 14th century. And last - hit the hay - go to bed. Early mattresses were stuffed with hay. These are the origins I am aware of. I'm sure there are more ideas about where they came from. There are, I believe, several American Idioms dictionaries in print. There are literally hundreds of idioms. Quite amusing.
• Australia
8 Sep 12
I wish I could find a theory on brand spanking new , but my imagination fails me - at least on this site. Lash Lash Lash Lash Lash (Ooops)
• Australia
7 Sep 12
This is one of the multitude of euphemisms for terms that used to be considered blasphemous, like "heck" for "hell", "grief" for "God" (I don't quite follow that myself), or "goodness gracious" for "God God". A lot of them are ironic, like the fat chance thin chance example you give. No point in trying to think logically, I'm sure your own language, let alone your version of English, has hundreds of similar displacement words for all sorts of things. It took you to point me to the ones in my language, we don't notice them because they are terms we use automatically, and you almost certainly have the same issues. By the way, if someone from your culture spoke of "forbidden love", what would that mean to you? Lash
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
We have all love forbidden..lol Remember Indians dont have love marriages? Most of them anyway..lol The girls look at the bank balances and property values of in-laws and of course the qualifications of the guy. Based on that, consent is given because future is secure. Thereafter, it is cultivation of love I suppose..lol. Sorry..today I seem to be in such weird mood. :)
• Australia
7 Sep 12
So the term forbidden love might apply to people who have fallen in love but who are not seen as suitable marriage partners? Lash
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
Pretty much..lol I think most Indians are obsessed with this need for financial security, so they ignore love when it visits them. :)
@Janey1966 (24170)
• Carlisle, England
7 Sep 12
I learned a new Cumbrian word the other day (Cumbria is in England in case you didn't know) and it's "gammy." I mean, I've used it in the past in another part of England (Lancashire) and we tend to use the word to describe something like a lame leg as in "gammy leg." However, in the Cumbrian context it can just mean you're feeling unwell. Another one I've heard them use a lot is "badly" as in, "I'm not going into work today because I'm feeling badly." One Cumbrian word I use a lot is "cowie" a word that is used whenever I can't remember a name or anything else come to that, "Did you see cowie on the telly the other night..you know, whatsername?" If you weren't confused before I bet you are now!
• Omagh, Northern Ireland
7 Sep 12
Maybe Gammy travels well.. We'd understand that here in NI too! Let's see what local specialities I can come up with.. Gorb (greedy Person) Yer Man (or Woman)-would be like "Cowie" nope..drawing a blank on more at the moment!
• Omagh, Northern Ireland
7 Sep 12
I got a look at the "Irish" section on that site..a lot of it would be what would be considered Dublin Slang,though some of it wouldn't be what I'd consider dialect..the Dandelion is referred to as "Pee in the Bed" (I'd recognise them as "Pee the beds")-a reference to Dandelion being used in herbal medicine as a diuretic...descriptive,not dialect.. "Barn Brack" was listed without a reference..this is a NI local speciality fruited tea bread..
@Janey1966 (24170)
• Carlisle, England
7 Sep 12
You may like this website..and there is probably a NI version somewhere. Some of the words on this site I've heard regularly like "bewer" and "gadgee." There are also regional variations too as I couldn't understand what people from Longtown were on about but - worryingly, I do now!! http://www.thedialectdictionary.com/view/letter/Cumbrian/page1/?view=standard
@jennyze (7029)
• Indonesia
14 Sep 12
Sometimes we don't need to think logically about a language. "Just do as what Romes do when in Rome" isn't that the very best way? Understand that when we need to translate that into our own language we had to flip on dictionary a lot to find the correct expression...
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
18 Sep 12
Usually in the context it is used, we can capture the meaning to an extent. But imagine somebody typing nabbit to a response. I would wonder if that n is a mistake. And whether the person wanted to type r instead of n. lol. But the word nabbit exists, and it means da mn . lol.
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
19 Sep 12
nabbit can be used as a stand alone...that is when the problem arises ..lol At least, it arose for me..
@jennyze (7029)
• Indonesia
19 Sep 12
Wow, really? I didn't know that. I should check. Well, I would go by the whole sentence to grasp the real meaning...
@else22 (4317)
• India
7 Sep 12
Good grief!This is the first time I have come across such a term.I also feel it to be confusing.Another example of such terms is,'pretty hard.'If something is hard,how can it be pretty.And how can pretty things be hard.Sounds self-contradictory.Such usages confuse me either.I don't care.I don't want to be a great scholar of English.My mother tongue serves all purposes for which knowledge of a language is necessary.English is a foreign language that is imposed on us.
• Omagh, Northern Ireland
7 Sep 12
"Good Grief" was a popular catchphrase of Charlie Brown from the famous "Peanuts" comic strip and cartoon series..
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
9 Sep 12
I came across before but as usual I used to wonder why on earth do these English speaking people come up with such usage..so finally I asked..lol You quoted ..pretty hard..good one..lol
@else22 (4317)
• India
8 Sep 12
I can understand.Brown must have used it for good and valid reasons.English is his language and he knows how to use it.For us who are not native English speakers and who don't have a grip over the languages,such usages are confusing.
@urbandekay (18278)
13 Oct 12
I think 'good grief' is a euphemism for 'God's grief' just as the expression 'cor blimey' is a euphemism or contraction for 'God blind me' all the best, urban
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
21 Dec 12
Really...god blind me? lol And here is an exclusive joke for you. You know Britishers ruled us for quite a few years. And the priests or preachers always used god the good. So local folks incorporated it in their language...and in a way to ridicule the Christian gods. So if something was unbelievable, it became god the good, slowly over a period, from one person to another gawd the good, and then gaad di gooddu - which has perfect additions from local dialect called Telugu. Now, gaad di gooddu literally means...egg of the donkey.
@JohnRok1 (2051)
21 Dec 12
Is this egg of the donkey fertilised or not?
@urbandekay (18278)
7 Sep 12
Or a bus conductor hurrying a passenger to disembark who calls, "Come on (hurry up) get off." all the best urban
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
Yeah..how true..
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
The words "come on" are used so many times in different context that they no longer import the same meaning..may be, or may be they do. Perhaps user considers himself to be a few steps above the other..lol
@ShepherdSpy (8544)
• Omagh, Northern Ireland
7 Sep 12
The "Good Grief" thing would be part of the biblical commandment about not taking the Lord's Name in Vain..instead of saying G--,a euphemism ,perhaps beginning with the same letter,would be put in instead.. Devout Christians would have a number of non profane expletives such as that they might use..
• Omagh, Northern Ireland
7 Sep 12
Yep,the written language can sometimes be more formal than the spoken language...but different English speaking nationalities have their own dialect which might not get an exact translation in a subtitled Movie..you may get a local translation on screen of what the phrase or term means,or even the subtitler's own interpretation..
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
Shepherd..there is difference between what you all write and what you all talk also, did you notice that? On average many of idioms sucha s "good grief" dont appear in subtitles of English/American/Australian movies. The language there is presumably the one you all use on day to day basis. However, novels and other things have such language..which does confuse us because we rarely come across it. :)
@bhanusb (5709)
• India
7 Sep 12
Yes vandana "good grief" is a nice coin from English language. It can be used as 'sweet but painful memory'. I can't understand some slang of English language. English speaking people often use slang. We the non-native English speaking people are learning many words of English from the native English speakers. Thanks to them. I can't find the proper alternative word of "Romance" in my language(Bengali). Every language has its special character.
• Australia
8 Sep 12
bhanusb, in fact it is never, to my knowledge, used to express 'sweet but painful memory', although that would be a clever guess at its literal meaning. It in fact means no more than a non-blasphemous way of saying "Good God" as an expression of surprise or disgust or wonder. Lash
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
Romance is also used to express something exciting..which is strange I would say romance is between man and woman but some adventure or travel being romantic seems funny..
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
I always smile when they say romance is in air..because my mind conjures up image of a kites romancing in sky..lol.
@webearn99 (1742)
• India
7 Sep 12
There is plain English, there is overstated English and then there is understated English. These are the unique nuances which make a language intersting. We have some of these in our language Telugu too. Like, "nindukunnadi". Used in the costal regions, though it literally means "has become full", means the opposite, "empty". I agree with you that interaction is a great teacher. The good point here is that it is also fun. Also there are some phrases which lose meaning in translation, like the blessing starting with "My sons". This was used once in my school with disasterously funny result. You know what it becomes when it is translated into Telugu, a street slur.
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
Yeah..that is one aspect I noticed too..nuns used to call us child, out here, if the words came out of my mouth people would look at me weirdly. lol In Christianity My son has very nice meaning to it..it means I care for you as much as I care for my son. In telugu it implies I had s e x with your mother. So bad. I am sorry I dont know about "nindukunnadi" but that is because I am not familiar with Telugu as much as I was not here during my formative years. I still dont know how to read the language. Not that it is something to feel proud about. I never needed to know it that deep after growing up. So ..:( But now that you do remind me, I did come across a strange usage in the temple during my recent visit to Tirupati. The priest said "Deepalu Konda ekatunnayi". I dont know what it means I wanted to ask aunty but I forgot. Did it mean that the lamps are lit too much and because of that the light is too much..it didnt seem that way though..may be the priest was angry. We went on Poornima day last Friday. Supposed to be very auspicious, isn't it? :)
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
Well ..Kalam Chesaru, I would have interpreted it as somebody who spent time in the prison..lol That is how ignorant I am about those idioms, phrases, and as you mentioned Euphemisms. lol
@allknowing (130066)
• India
7 Sep 12
Those expressions are used in informal chats and one does not find them in print. If you really want to improve, you must listen to BBC or CNN news channels. Or even read the Readers' Digest.
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
15 Sep 12
Till subtitles were not around, I used to concentrate on films. Now, I seem to be reading the subtitles and learning how to pronounce the words as well. Route is one word I used to think it should be pronounced as root, becoz should has the vovels and consonents almost in same sequence. But I learnt it is ra oot. lol. :) Yeah BBC and CNN..would do me good I suppose. Strangely I dont find such expressions as common in those subtitles as I should be. But yes, they are there in story books for sure.
@allknowing (130066)
• India
15 Sep 12
The mistakes that people commit when it comes to the English language is universal and in them native speakers are also included. So relax vandana.
• India
7 Sep 12
Vandanaji First of all i am happy to see your picture here To us english is certainly funny, and i think our hindi may appear difficult to others, particularly the grammer
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
9 Sep 12
ligwan..trust me, I have problem in writing Hindi..lol @Professor..thank you. :) But like..more people converse in English than they converse in Hindi right? So more people need to know what it means.
• India
7 Sep 12
i agree welcome
@ligwan (44)
• Philippines
7 Sep 12
not just the grammar sir but I think the spelling also.. I am not judgemental though. peace to you all
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@iola2012 (172)
• Philippines
7 Sep 12
That is an idiomatic expressions used by native speakers. There are also some used street words or slang words. The idiomatic expressions are not literally said, it connotes other meaning, like grab a bite: it means to eat something.
• Omagh, Northern Ireland
7 Sep 12
Dang or dagnabbit would be used in place of Dam- ....
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
7 Sep 12
Yes that grab a bite also..and in one of the discussions, Lamby used nabbit..I wanted to ask what it meant..they also use another word very often - Dang..lol
@Asylum (47893)
• Manchester, England
9 Oct 12
Yes, we have a lot of apparently strange phrases were the true grammatical use of the words would be meaningless. These phrases are so commonly used that everyone understands the implied meaning without even thinking about the individual words. Phrases such as "hard luck" or "At sixes and sevens" tend to be treated as valid in the same way that we accept the meaning of a single word without analysing the letters it is composed of. Many of such phrases can be traced back to their origin and therefore be explained, but a vast number of them have been around so long that their original reasons are lost to us forever. I agree that this must be very confusing for someone who learns English as a pure language rather then familiarity from childhood. I usually try to avoid these kind of terms when speaking to a person from another country.
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
10 Oct 12
Yeah the one that immediately come to mind is "hit the road", and it simply doesnt make sense unless we are accustomed to reading such things regularly and in the right context. :)
• India
8 Sep 12
Hello my friend vandana7 Ji, Well, it is very easy to find faults in others, but very equally difficult to hilight one's own. To find out your language, first I should learn your language and then I can tell you if there are no faults/confusions. In english there are different pronounciations for 'BUT/PUT', WHY?. May God bless You and have a great time
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
9 Sep 12
Hi MGB, I am not finding fault. I am trying to learn the meaning of expressions which do not make sense to us who are not native English speakers. I also do not find most of these expressions on television sub titles, so I presume they are not used regularly by them as well. I just wanted to ask them that please explain your idioms since we non-native English speaking communities might misinterpret. :)
@alberello (4752)
• Italy
15 Sep 12
Well, there are definitely ways of saying details even in my Italian language (you know, I'm Italian), however, since I am a native speaker, I do not mind. However, I must say that my English language, in these two years of hard work here on Mylot, had improved! This makes me happy! I learned many words, and also some way of saying such as "be in your shoes," or "a whale of time", etc.. Are English idioms, that we, being of the mother tongue, can sometimes deceive us. Only a matter of learning and experience!
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
16 Sep 12
Oh yes, a whale of time, I came across that one too..and spent time trying to understand what it meant. Be in your shoes is something I'd heard before. Actually it is not enough if we know how to communicate. We also should know how to use those idioms to really enjoy some of the jokes. :) I have also improved in my English after joining myLot. At least I think so. :)
@natliegleb (5175)
• India
8 Sep 12
for sure,it has become more grieved and more over aiming at some wealth and more importantly it is funny for me.we cant help it,that is how language blossoms
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
9 Sep 12
Yes, idioms are beautiful part of the language. They are as somebody mentioned, clever way or euphemism for saying some words. They also require us to be quite knowledgeable to understand the meanings of those words. :) Deazil has some very good and new ones listed above with explanations, if you would want to get familiar with a few in engliish. :)
@JohnRok1 (2051)
10 Oct 12
Vandana, I think I can explain that one: We are nominally a Christian country and in the past many Britons were steeped in the language and teaching of the Bible. The greatest grief ever experienced was that of the Saviour on the cross, when He was bearing the sins of all who would believe on Him and of all who had believed on Him in figure in the past. Indeed Isaiah (53:4), prophesying of Him some 700 year previously, wrote "Surely he hath borne our griefs, and carried our sorrows". This grief He suffered is good, because it brought about the salvation of all His. Thus the phrase "Good Grief" is one of the many references to the things of God that people, some in complete ignorance of their true meaning, use blasphemously as expletives (This comes under the heading of blasphemy against the Son of Man and can be forgiven - Luke 12:10). One thing about English that's so confusing, of course, is "spelling". I have to tell my foreign friends that English only appears to have an alphabet. In reality our orthography is like Chinese, without the mitigating grace of pictorial representation that might give a clue to their meaning (e.g., the eight mouths representing the eight people saved in Noah's Ark being used to mean "Boat"). One of their favourite examples is "Ghoti": The "gh" is pronounced as in "enough", the "o" is pronounced as in "women" and the the "ti" as in Temptation. The result is more usually spelled "Fish". Whom do you know that's tried to learn Sindhi as an adult (or Hindi, if that's your native language)? Would they confirm that they know of no confusing expressions in your native language? And even if English speakers don't have a problem, others might. Do you use, for instance, as we do, the phrase "He lifted up his eyes" to mean "He looked upwards"? To some natives of South America this might mean "He took his eyes out of their sockets and held them aloft"!
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
21 Dec 12
You sure had me in splits with that last one..I literally imagined eyes being pulled out of the sockets. But your explanation does seem reasonable. And now I do understand English a bit better. It also makes me realize how little I know. :)
@roshigo58 (4859)
• Pune, India
10 Sep 12
Hi, Yes, English is very funny language. But I enjoy writing in English. There are many words which pronunciation is but the meaning is very different. Sometimes some humor is created by the same words.
@vandana7 (98826)
• India
10 Sep 12
Me too ..:) It think some aspects of it are not very confusing..that is the reason it makes us comfortable. That does not mean we know everything..we can manage, that is all..:)