December 16, 2012 - Eyewitness' account of the gangrape...

@vandana7 (51357)
India
January 6, 2013 12:02am CST
First, the pluses and minuses Plus 1. He indicated the loophole that people do not help because they are scared that police would trouble them with red tape later on, so something needs to be done about it. 2. He indicated that nearest hospital should be called in to assist, irrespective of whether it is a government hospital or not. 3. He indicated that the legal process takes too long, and surprise surprise...despite all that clear indication of whodunnit...we are giving fair trial..for god's sake, the girl is dead. 4. He indicated that since he is educated and has some lawyers in the family, he knew how to go about knocking the right doors for justice. There are several people out here in our country (Bhanwri Devi) who do not know the law and can therefore be sent from pillar to post for every small legal aspect. It is all very well to flash those things on television. Not many uneducated people know what is FIR and where are the police stations. 5. He indicated that police are ill equipped to handle such emergencies...why should they have been running to a hotel for fetching a fresh bedsheet...surely they can carry something like that along with first aid box if they are on night patrol.. Now minuses 1. He said police took several minutes to come. I think 4 to 5 minutes is reasonably prompt in the cold December night when fog does impair the vision. Perhaps it is the perception because of pain and the situation that he was in. 2. He said police were arguing about jurisdiction under which FIR is to be registered. I am ok with that because in all probability they were planning about whose vehicle the injured need to board - WHILE THEY WERE WAITING FOR A BEDSHEET from a nearby hotel. Being in pain the eyewitness might have felt each minute to as long as 5 minutes. Such perceptions happen. 3. He said people didnt care. They did. There were three police vehicles out there. Even if he called one, others must have called the other two, right? And even those who traveled in cars and slowed down must have called, but by the time, the control room people must have realized they were talking about the same accident. 4. He said people didnt care...but imagine in the middle of foggy cold night when you are intent on reaching home and out of blue you find somebody coming out suddenly on to the road with not so visible blood but walking in a way that is more of staggering like that of drunkard. Remember the girl was lying down...and many homeless do lie on the sides of the roads...and there was no vehicle with this couple to judge it as an accident. Right? Most people care...they might have mistaken him to be a drunkard..trying to create nuisance...iron rod in his head was barely visible. It is not a flourescent object, is it...and the lights of a vehicle are not positioned on the head level of a person. Some might have got scared too. So it is not as if people didnt care. I hope media explains it to him, and I hope he understands and accepts the possibility because people have been praying for him and the girl almost everyday. 5. He said people didnt care...some may have called ambulances of some hospitals that they knew. Unfortunately, those ambulances might have been simply too far and there is red tape in every hospital regarding ambulances...after all, somebody has to incur the charges...and a paramedic needs to be around at the right time. So people care..and I feel it is a wrong perception on the part of the eye witness. 6. He said it was he who loaded the girl on the vehicle. I dont think so..I think it is impossible to do that alone - he didnt look like Salman Khan, Hrithik Roshan, or Akshay Kumar or Aamir Khan who do push ups everyday to be carrying a girl with fracture of leg and badly bruised arms. In fact, he looked as if he had a belly - lazy belly like me. He might have done something that was fairly independent but he might be recollecting it wrongly or has answered it wrongly due to leading questions. Indian media should learn not to bring in lies into such cases..it reduces the gravity of the incident in the mind of others, who will start questioning everything that they are told. 7. Police...their role...their training...while I agree that the eye-witness' perceived every minute delay as five minutes delay ...due to pain and not deliberately, I will also question that do police people have to be trained to pull out their sweater and cover the girl till the bedsheet arrives? They would definitely not die of biting cold but the girl with that kind of injuries would. 8. Police their role...taking to safdarjung hospital or government hospital...may be as per rule book or training but wouldnt they have liked to take the victim to a near by hospital had it been their sister or their daughter? This is the one that stinks...really stinks. All they had to do was call their seniors tell them that injuries seem fatal and so they want to go to a private hospital closeby till the required assistance with ambulance and paramedics can be got...30 minutes drive after remaining almost 30 minutes on the road. You gotta be kidding me that police care. 9. We the people...if we look down upon the police ...who quite often try to do their duties, but have become indifferent to their jobs because of interference from above (politicians) due to which they cant really get promotions and do well in their lives, do we really have a protection of any sort? We may throw one officer out or one constable out today. That does not mean there would be no more mistakes. We all make mistakes. I am not saying we forgive wholeheartedly, but I am saying understand them also so that they dont become anti us. They are also humans. Sorry for the length...but do you take everything that media presents to you at the face value?
1 person likes this
5 responses
@thesids (22470)
• Bhubaneswar, India
6 Jan 13
Hi vandana I dont have a tele but I did read this guy's interview yesterday on FB and also on Internet and today, the newspapers. Now, the Police in India needs to be redefined. I was watching some youtube a few days back and they depicted how quickly medical help reaches victims in US even though they have more busy roads in case of accidents. Even Kiran Bedi too seemed to be unhappy with the delayed medical help to the victim and this guy. As for media and their reports... I dont trust them on most occasions. Even the live interviews - most of the times, they hand out the questions to be asked to the one who is being interviewed and the responses are edited out on many instances before being recorded or shown live. At least that is what I learned when I attended a 3-day workshop on TV shows and Mass Journalism in 1997-98. So if they could tell us this then, today, they are much more needed.
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@vandana7 (51357)
• India
6 Jan 13
Exactly. Media is seizig this opportunity to paint police as out and out bad because it increases their TRP rating. While there are lapses, lets not make police force so vulnerable and scared that they become ineffective. Let them realize they could have done better rather than make them defensive about their actions. That way, they would be pro citizens. Frankly, they may be knowing that the persons they caught has a godfather upstairs in political circle. And so there is little that they can do about it. Poor fellows. We need to lynch the politicians. We are shouting at police. How could the politicians make such arbitrary statements and not be lynched?
@thesids (22470)
• Bhubaneswar, India
6 Jan 13
Frankly, they may be knowing that the persons they caught has a godfather upstairs in political circle. I completely agree. The said bus was roaming around on the streets of Posh Delhi and it was for hours or so. And none of the cops had an eye to that! So it must have been an upper hand somewhere. Also, the criminals were caught sooner (much sooner) once the orders from the Ministry came - doesnt that confirm that the cops know about the culprits and still take no action? The police as one ISI friend of mine (an ex-collegemate) said - is torn between facts and reality and many a times, the police wants to take actions but the Politics and its interference plays bad. Many movies have showcased this fact, millions believe it to be true, even the cops agree to it and still they remain evasive of action at the right times. That is really pathetic not only for them but also for all of Indians. A solution to this can be - we should have two types of cops - one who work for the Politicians - like their security etc and the other who stays independent of all these politics and do social good for which they are known. (Though I do not agree to politicians needing any security, but it is a distant dream kind of thing in the present scenario). But that is what happens in UK or even US, I guess, The law enforcing and implementing agencies are independent of politics. And in India we only adopted - independence of Jury and Courts - which made things bad.
@vandana7 (51357)
• India
6 Jan 13
No...politicos should not be allowed to call police force at all in respect of any case involving private individuals. Anything that involves terrorists or other gangsters should be controlled - yes. But for that, relevant instructions should be passed along with members of opposition, and possibly a member of media who would be sworn to secrecy. I am sure media would love the first scoop so it is possible to get the media involved. Apathy of police is primarily because they do their job sincerely initially, only to be transferred or told to leave the criminal because of orders from above. So where are the chances of their promotion when they do a good job? Over the years, they become indifferent, and at times take out the frustration on people in the prison, especially those who do not have godfathers in political circles. In crime patrol, there are very few crimes that are reported in which politicos are involved. Ironically, many of the MLAs and MPs are involved in some crimes, and have cases pending against them.
@sanjay91422 (2717)
• India
6 Jan 13
It was a long post and it is first time that I have read such a long post to full length here in Mylot. I agree to your conclusions, I think police is not that bad. Like you said there is only a lack of training so they did not put their jacket or cloth, and I think no body would have thought of such a horrible incident could happen so they are not trained like that.
@vandana7 (51357)
• India
6 Jan 13
Then let me thank you for your patience to understand my views. I think police are our allies. We need to try to get them out of the clutches of politicians, instead we are behaving like...blame the small time gangstar and forget his boss. Time media stopped thinking of it just like a story, and went after the real bad guys who prevent the implementation of law. Surely they can search for data, and find out which politico was involved in getting the release of rape accused. That would help a lot!!!
• India
6 Jan 13
Still two assistant police commissioner were suspended from the duty, because they were not able to stop this incident. I am not aware much of the duties of the police on duty but if it was there duty then they are rightly punished for it.
@vandana7 (51357)
• India
6 Jan 13
Did you notice that there is increase in reports of violence against women? And police apathy.. For one, bad guys are also watching television and reading newspapers. So they know that they cant be punished much under the present laws because of the loopholes. They also know that police would be blamed for their mistakes. Yes, suspending two assistant police commissioners is no solution to this issue. It only makes police force more nervous and anti citizen because citizens are emerging as another set of boss. They already have bosses within their offices, then the politicians, then the media, and now people..how many masters can a person serve?
@BarBaraPrz (15188)
• Hamilton, Ontario
6 Jan 13
You've done a lot of thinking about this incident.
@vandana7 (51357)
• India
6 Jan 13
I am hurt...in another twenty years or so, I will be in my grave, but no matter how hard I worked during my life, and no matter how hard other girls are working to bring prosperity to this nation, our country has nothing to offer to us women. Following the incident, 40 percent of ladies have either stopped working or are not staying back late in the offices as they used to earlier for completing their work. Soon there would be a day when ladies would not go out to buy vegetables either.
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@BarBaraPrz (15188)
• Hamilton, Ontario
6 Jan 13
I sincerely hope things change for the better, and soon.
@Admin1993 (628)
• India
6 Jan 13
I have no good idea about that but i came to your discussions and only just saw the word gangrape,so i'm just participating. Firstly,India 2013 have a very bad start,I heard 6men raped a 21year old medical girl,and she was thrown out of running bus. Well,i don't have enough information but it's time and essential to pinpoint all those offenders and must punish them severly.It has beome more scared for us espicially for those sister who occasionally hangout with their friends. Thsnks a ton for starting this discussions.
@vandana7 (51357)
• India
6 Jan 13
I too want severe punishment for the offenders.
@dollar3235 (2063)
• India
6 Jan 13
Hi Vandana, Frankly, I think this is the lengthiest discussion starter comment, I've ever read. When you talk about media and Bollywood, they are responsible for such things in society but when such things happen, for the sake of formality they'll come up and earn money/fame while protesting against such things. Check the MSN website, first news is about women being treated badly in our country and then there will be a news flash with women served as a peace of meat in that photo. Whether it's Yahoo or MSN or Rediff, on all these websites you can see such news on daily basis and even in news papers, you will have a few photos which you won't like your children to see but you can't tell them not to read the news paper. This media starts such things for earning money and then every time they change the reality for their benefit. Even people instead of protesting against these things they enjoy such kind of news and the result of that is in front of us. As far as this Delhi case is concerned, I'll certainly go by the words of the victim, if he says, there was a delay of 45 mins, I'm sure after 20 days, he won't just come out and lie. If you feel that the police did everything right, I'm sure you've never experienced the behavior of Indian police. For the criminals, I would say, government should do us a favor by revealing their identity and their address on a website and then police should just release them without any charges, there are enough people and anger in this society, these criminals will be taken care of by us, this will save our tax money (that will be spent on these criminals when they are in jail) and our time and people will be relaxed and the same time, such criminals will realize the consequences of such deeds.
@vandana7 (51357)
• India
6 Jan 13
dollar...I have been through some accidents..and I felt I couldnt accurately recall things in right sequence...and there time and space variation..which definitely must have happened in the case of this braveheart because of the iron rod in his head. Delay of 45 minutes ...is from the time he was thrown on the road and not from the time police was intimated. Agreed that frequency of patroling cannot be compromised on. But when intimated, there were three of those vehicles rushing out to help. Really indifferent police would have tried to contact the control room to confirm if anybody had already left towards that destination. I think driving in fog especially when light makes it sparkle is not as easy. We wouldnt want police patrol cars involved in any accident, would we? Considering the GPS data that has been provided I am satisfied that they rushed to help. Perhaps they could have called out to following vehicle to pick a few bedsheets enroute so about 10 to 15 minutes could have been spared. That speaks of lack of training rather than indifference. However, not covering the girl with their sweaters and shirts, and not taking these people to the nearest hospital was the mistake of the police that is hard to condone. But dollar, we the people need to work as a team against politicians. We cant antagonize the police force who are already trying to be free from political interference. You dont believe rapists are politicians henchmen? I think they must be some karyakartas of some political party, or relatives of some karyakartas. Such kind of fearless of police can only come when they know that there is somebody up there who can get them off the hook. So why blame the police alone. Even if they want to do their duty well, there is no scope for job satisfaction.