You can't sacrifice what you don't have

United Kingdom
November 15, 2017 7:09am CST
Today, I have read about an estate agent suggesting that anyone could easily afford a deposit for a house by simply sacrificing luxuries. I'm not going to argue that as a possibility. Of course, if you, as this estate agent assumes, go on lots of holidays, buy lunches every day, have regular takeaways, expensive nights out, etc. then, yes, it wouldn't be a hardship to sacrifice some of those things. The thing is this: firstly, it's quite rude to assume that people who can't afford something haven't already thought of saving or cutting back. The second thing is assuming everyone has luxuries in the first place. It's extremely patronising for someone who can clearly afford luxuries to tell people who can barely make ends meet that they should cut back on luxuries that they most likely don't have because they can't afford. This estate agent estimated that it would take 5 years to save £33000. Without even taking into account whether that's enough of a deposit or if you'd be able to get a mortgage anyway, that would mean saving half the income or more for a lot of people. That's simply not feasible for the average person, especially when paying high rents. Telling someone who's not sure if they'll be able to pay all their bills each month that all they need to do is give up holidays and takeaways, that's so patronising. As is assuming that the only reason people are not financially better off is because they're wasteful. Poorer people are often really good at budgeting because they have to be! So, yes, if you have a good job, if you are frivolous, if you can sacrifice luxuries, then of course you could easily save money by not doing those things. But so many people simply don't have the luxury of luxury. I don't consider myself poor but I certainly struggle at times. There are things I could cut out but it won't be anywhere near enough to save a deposit for a house in 10 years, let alone 5. So, I'll keep my gym membership for now. I'll have that one guaranteed 'luxury' instead of trying to save for something that won't be within my reach before I'm 50, if ever. I've been to budgeting workshops where the advice seemed to be from people who assumed that everyone on a low income had no common sense. There was advice like 'you don't need to buy new make-up all the time' and 'don't buy a new outfit for evwry occasion'. This was aimed at people who mostly didn't own make-up and were wearing 10+ year old clothes because buying new stuff for themselves wasn't a priority in the first place! When I've been struggling before, I've had people tell me to just work harder, or I should have done better at school, or to simply save a little. So then I tell them about my academic credentials and how much I already do. They tend nit to come back with any response! So, do you find such things patronising? Have you been in a situation where someone has told you (how) to do something when you've already done it or been offered advice from someone who obviously lives in a different world?
5 people like this
5 responses
@Fleura (34927)
• United Kingdom
15 Nov 17
I can see both sides of this. I've also seen several articles lately saying how young people could easily afford to buy a home if they cut back on luxuries. Leaving aside the question of whether £33,000 would be anywhere near enough for a deposit (I had to save up almost twice that to buy my first house 14 years ago) I find it laughable - I never did any of those things they tell us to cut back on, and still don't. Haven't had a take-away meal in many years, virtually never buy a take-away coffee or go to a café, very rarely go for meals out (once or twice this year so far), get my clothes from charity shops, furniture bought second-hand, family hand-me-downs or from Freegle, have always taken a packed lunch, drive a 12-year-old ordinary car.... But anyone looking at me now from the outside would probably think I was a patronising so-and-so looking down at them from my luxury life, because through doing all those things I have now worked up to a lovely house and look as if I'm living in the lap of luxury. And often I see people spending £4 or more on a coffee, maybe £10 on a take-away lunch, and then I think it's no wonder they can't save up for a house. It all comes down to the fact that you can never make assumptions about another person's situation.
2 people like this
• United Kingdom
15 Nov 17
I'm not saying it's an impossible thing for some people. I've seen plenty of people tell me they can't afford this, that, amd the other while stuffing their face with expensive foods or buying the latest gadgets. For you, not having those luxuries worked. My point is really about those who don't have any of those luxuries in the first place but still couldn't save because there's nothing left. Also, you don't appear to assume other people can do it just because you did. You did it but you're nit assuming everyone else can. Of course, sometimes you'll see a person spend £4 on a coffee and not know that they could have spent a month or more saving up for that little treat!
2 people like this
• United Kingdom
15 Nov 17
@Fleura I think if you can really want to help and you've been asked for your advice, that's OK. But it is patronising to tell someone with nothing that it's easy to save if they cut back.
2 people like this
@Fleura (34927)
• United Kingdom
15 Nov 17
@pumpkinjam No as you say, you can never assume. It's like when someone vandalises a fancy car because they are jealous of that 'rich' person's fancy life - how do they know the owner didn't save up for years to buy their dream car? I often think I would like to be able to help others in some way to make their money go further and make life easier, but I'm afraid I would be seen as a patronising rich person out of touch with the real world.
2 people like this
@inertia4 (27978)
• United States
15 Nov 17
This is a great post. I totally agree with you on this. All those money advisors are about the same. They do assume that we in the lower end of the financial food chain spend more than we have to. Which we all know is not true. We are not morons or idiots. We are just as smart, if not smarter than they are about money. I would like to see those people live in our shores for just one week and see how they can handle it. Yes, can I save some money? Yes I can. But the bills do take up most of my monthly income. So the savings is small at best. Which leaves me with very little to use for the month for little things.
2 people like this
@Fleura (34927)
• United Kingdom
15 Nov 17
@pumpkinjam @inertia4 Sometimes the 'haves' have got there their own way and they may have some useful tips!
2 people like this
• United Kingdom
15 Nov 17
@Fleura That was kind of my point. If they have made it on their own, they may well have useful tips. The problem is when people who have always been well-off are telling people with nothing that they have to cut back.
2 people like this
@inertia4 (27978)
• United States
16 Nov 17
@pumpkinjam Nice!!! You are one hundred percent correct about this. And lets be realistic here, those rich people that try to advise us could really care less about us.
2 people like this
@maximax8 (31042)
• United Kingdom
9 Jun 18
When people work on their debts they see progress when they have paid off their smallest debt. Then they have their new confidence to pay off the next smallest debt. It is like that when saving money however it is hard to save enough for a house deposit.
@LadyDuck (502190)
• Italy
15 Nov 17
Unfortunately it happens all the time. People want to suggest what to do and they think they are the only one capable to make money, save money to buy things and even put money aside for your old age. This was something possible many, many years ago. In our days many cannot even save a cent at the end of the month.
2 people like this
@Daelii (5619)
• United States
15 Nov 17
General advice given in general terms, shouldn't really be taken personally. Nothing said in general terms will ever meet/be true for EVERYone. So, I do have to kinda agree with them, it is possible for anyone to get a house if they really want one. Its a matter of priorities and what is important. Making good choices now and in the future. Saving 20k or more might seem like a pipe dream for some. What about looking for the "Rent to Own" options? pay rent + a little extra, that after enough time (depends on contract), a percentage of what was already paid = down payment... So on and so on. I don't like advice from people who have no clue. Its in general, rude, unless asked for. All people have different views on what is considered a need or a want. For my house? having multiple cell phones isn't a need or a want, its a luxury that would be wasteful at this moment. Cable tv? is a luxury that at times, we totally went without. Why pay 100 dollars or more for TV?? We get free tv for taking care of the neighbors lawn. So if it wasn't for that, I'd be cool going without it. Other people though, might really need TV because someone is house bound and not able to move around/do things. Each house is different and has different needs. I'd like to think most can make smart choices but usually those budget classes are made for people in general, and often times, there are a lot of people who invest only in themselves and their next party hook up and they forget the kids exist.
2 people like this
• United Kingdom
16 Nov 17
This was a general statement from an estate agent that 'everyone' can save thousands by giving up luxuries (apparently oblivious to the fact that a lot of people don't have luxuries to give up). That's simply not true for a lot of people. Yes, people have different views on what is essential but the point a lot of people have, quite rightly, made is that there are people who already have none of those things. Personally, I can go without many of the things people might consider luxuries. The issue here, to me anyway, is the assumption that everyone who is struggling must be due to being wasteful. That everyone could somehow have thousands to spare if only they didn't have holidays or takeaways when many don't have those things anyway. I know plenty of people who could probably buy a castle by cutting back on things they don't need! These people are wasteful. That's very different from a person who struggles because their essential bills are higher than their income without even cobsidering anything we might see as a luxury. It doesn't matter how good you are at budgeting if you have nothing to budget with. And the rent to own option is still not an option if you can't get a mortgage and come up with a deposit in the first place. I've only known one couple do that. They regretted it and wish they'd waited to buy a house outright! Obviously, that's just one example so I can't say hiw successful such a thing is overall.
2 people like this
@Daelii (5619)
• United States
16 Nov 17
@pumpkinjam it depends on the rent to own contract. A person has to come up with a deposit anyway to rent a place (usually first and last month's rent, plus a payment of about equal to one months rent to be held in escrow for any possible damages). I hate to say it, but I still agree with the agent. It's sad that it's got to the point where people pick on everything. Had they said anything to limit or qualify types of people there would be screaming about racism, discrimination, etc. Essential bills higher than income? I hate to say it but people are in control of their choices in life. Often times a mortgage is actually cheaper than rent including the cost of property taxes on the mortgage.