Is poverty a state of mind?
By Aussies2007
@Aussies2007 (5336)
Australia
September 28, 2007 1:09pm CST
In the past few weeks... I had many people in myLot's discussions arguing that poverty was just a state of mind and that you can be rich by positive thinking.
My argument is that it take a lot more than positive thinking. And the following article does describe what happen to people when they become poor.
At Bourke, between the 2001 and 2006 Census surveys, the outback shire lost 730 people - 20 per cent of its population - and was left with just 3200 hardy souls. No other local government area in NSW had a faster rate of population decline.
A report last year commissioned by the State Government declared Bourke was on the brink of social and economic disaster because of what drought had done to its agricultural base.
It said the drought's "impact is reflected sharply in higher crime figures, increased family separation, out-migration, reduced sponsorship of education and sport, increased mental health issues … drug and alcohol abuse, and children being brought back from boarding schools".
7 people like this
11 responses
@violeta_va (4831)
• Australia
26 Oct 07
you can think all you want that wont fill you belly you will just have very good imagination. lets tell our farmers to imagine that their storage is full of water that they have lots of green grass to feed the starving animals, thet petrol prices are very low. Tell them and wait for it :))))))))) Next time my husband tells me he is hungry I will tell him to imagine beef roast.
2 people like this
@Perspectives (7131)
• Canada
3 Oct 07
For one thing poverty, financial security, wealth and abundance do not have the same association for everyone. In the circumstances you describe the sudden change in lifestyle can create an inability to cope unless given the tools to do so. Any radical shift in anyone's lifestyle creates an un-grounding effect and it is not surprising that the figures you cite as a direct result of social and economic disaster.
The idea that positive thinking and working to change your life by changing your beliefs is something that doesn't happen instantly. It is a process of inner development where people decide what inner abundance represents to them. As we all know there are those with immense wealth who die shriveled up and alone like Howard Hughs. He had great financial wealth but was spiritually and emotionally impoverished. There are others who are happy, fulfilled and living with what they feel is an abundant life because they have enough supply to keep them and their families feeling comfortable within the means they have.
In our 17 years together David and I have learned that wealth is not just what we have..but what we can live without. Who is wealthier...the person who is addicted something and has plenty of money to buy it..or the person who doesn't desire the addictive substance at all? In my view truly wealthy people carry their riches within. They less they need of this physical world, the wealthier they are..whatever they have is fine.
Wealth and richness within positive thinking includes joy, balance, equanimity, inner peace..enjoying one's own company and the ability to love and appreciate ourselves...and others. So in this framework I see poverty and wealth in different frameworks than many others do...but it sure works for me!
Another good topic...I appreciate yours too!
Raia
@Aussies2007 (5336)
• Australia
3 Oct 07
I agree cent per cent with everything you just said.
And while my topic might not be a very good example of what poverty is... the result is the same.
Poverty is not about using a five year old computer because you cannot afford a new one. Or driving a 20 year old car because you cannot afford a new one.
Poverty is about constantly worrying about finding yourself in the street as you have a hard time coming up with the rent. It is about constantly worrying about having your electricity and phone cut off because you don't have the money to pay the bills.
People are not poor by choice. They get poor through circonstances. Half of the time... they did put themselve in the situation because of their own mistakes. But there are also many times when somebody else put them there. Having some health problems is beyond our control... even if our lifestyle caused it. Or in the case of this article... nature played an hand into it.
We can play the blame game and say that every individual is responsible for its own destiny. But by the same token... the drought is not a new thing in Australia. It has always existed. So those people who advocate that poverty is a state of mind... are actually saying that no-one in its right mind should have attempted to live from the land and try to become a farmer in Australia.
3 people like this
@Perspectives (7131)
• Canada
7 Oct 07
It is never my intent to create a sense of 'blame' for those who find themselves in compromising situations. I understand that the broader implications of global or economic catastrophes are not something brought upon themselves. The way these situations are handled is something that needs greater scrutiny and we all need to pause and consider how the distribution of the the planet's resources are often controlled in ways that do not work for the good of the all.
So please understand that I am not glossing over the larger implications within your post. There is no denial on my part that there are many who are so much less fortunate than those of us who feel a measure of safety and comfort in the lives we have. So once again we are not on opposite sides on the topic. I answered your post within my framework of 'poverty consciousness' and how it is possible to have an abundant life with less income once priorities are worked out in the brain.
The global challenges we face are something that will require different policies, unified support and I do not disagree with you that it all may be too late anyway. However, if I allowed myself to buy into that so much of what gives life meaning for me would be gone. I refuse to allow my train of thought to become so pessimistic that I stop trying to create a positive difference in whatever I say and do. If it works...great...if not I have the satisfaction of living true to my own moral compass.
So my friend...no I do not think that it is anyone's 'fault' when catastrophes devastate lives and people have to move into survival mode. It is as Maslov said in his work...it is very hard for anyone to focus on personal development without the basic needs of life being their first.
So another great addition for our thinkers to munch on. Take care until we chat again...
Raia
@andyliuzn (1029)
• Guangzhou, China
6 Oct 07
Hi Perspectives,
I totally agree with you that the less people need of this physical world, the wealthier hey are...
Positive thinking is really good for both healthy and wealthy.
Andy

@cblackink (969)
• United States
18 Oct 07
This is where "The Law Of Attraction" moves to a large scale. First of all, there is a universal law that operates behind the scenes, whether we want it to or not, and affects our lives. It's more complicated than just thinking positive thoughts. It's takes becoming a student and really learning and studying. It basically takes "unlearning" a lot of things.
Having said that, when we look at the hardships that many folks face over basic, daily survival, just because they don't have the money to pay rent, utilities, food, medical care, what makes us accept that as natural? This is a true flaw in our thinking. This is a belief that there is scarcity in the world, that poverty is acceptable. I know, without a doubt, there are enough natural resources in this world, right now, that everyone could have a home, food, electricity and medical care, even if they couldn't pay a dime. Shouldn't the basics be a given birthright to every human? There is NO scarcity in this world. There are corrupt institutions that are feeding off of our belief that this is "just the way it is". We all need to change our mindset about this.

@cblackink (969)
• United States
19 Oct 07
The problem is, I do live in the U.S. and our government has the ability to obliterate poverty, if it chose to do so. Instead, our president chooses to spend millions of our dollars fighting a ridiculous war, and we allow that. And our huge utility companies make money hand over fist, to the detriment of many average citizens. And the cost of living in many areas spirals out of control, but so many are complacent about that because, as I said, they believe that lack and struggle is normal and natural. And my point is, it isn't. I don't believe God put us here to suffer. And each individual person is responsible for changing their own way of perceiving how reality should be. It certainly doesn't happen overnight, as far as I can see. It does take some work.
1 person likes this
@Aussies2007 (5336)
• Australia
18 Oct 07
Actually you would be surprised to find that there is not as much as you think. There are simply too many people on the planet... and they won't stop multiplying.
If the western world cannot afford to give the basics to its own people... what chance is there that it will help those huge populations in third world countries?
Lets start with the 36 million people living in poverty in the USA before considering saving the world.
1 person likes this

@kalav56 (11464)
• India
26 Oct 07
'Poverty' is defined as 'scarcity and want 'and we normally associate it with a lack of the basic necessities of life. English is a beautiful language that gives us a great scope and epithets are used appropriately and forcefully to convey different ideas.Figurative usage takes precedence over the literary usage in many cases. I strongly feel that when you refer to the poverty of a person it only indicates the state of being and not the state of mind. Positive thinking can teach you equanimity of mind, a proper motivation and determination to find ways and means of survival,and methods to overcome this poverty .
There is a proverb in our language which says that when one person is wailing over his lack of salt for a rice porridge[indicating necessity] another is crying that he does not have enough sugar and flavour for his milk. [This is an age old proverb and here milk signifies luxury-do not interpret it from the current scenario, where milk may just be an affordable necessity.]
We are not talking of subjective and figurative interpretations of poverty but stating what it is.I have also seen rural folks and have heard what life was when there was drought. The lady who spoke to me was a very positive thinker and used to state facts as they were-she was a poor vegetable vendor, who was very rich in mind. Due to this right approach of hers she [an illiterate woman , widowed at a very young age with 4 children to support]pulled herself up, used to carry vegetables and deliver them door to door . Now her children are all married and she still carries on with her small business]-I have always admired her for her tenacity and extraordinary contentment. Nevertheless, her poverty could not be denied. It has been a sort of hand-to-mouth existence for her.
Coming back to the topic, I stick to what I said earlier-Poverty is undeniably a state of being[whether it is caused by self , by laziness, by squandering , or by natural disaster] and positive thinking can combat it and get you out of it. You speak to a person who had his/her basic necessities unfulfilled and who then came out of it-you will still hear him say that at one point of time he was terribly poor but positive thinking took him out of it. But the bitter truth cannot be denied.
Only what happens in real life is we find people like what I had quoted in my 2nd example[regional proverb]and this gives rise to arguments like what you have pointed out.
@kalav56 (11464)
• India
29 Oct 07
My response was to the question whether poverty is a state of mind and once again I say it is a state of being. While I agree, that one needs much more than a bowl of rice from life, we cannot deny that only a person who has a sure bowl of rice for the immediate meal would think of other things.On the other hand, to a person who does not know whether he is going to eat at all, you ask him the question he would certainly give you the dictionary definition.
Personally, I feel that it is a very sad topic .
@Aussies2007 (5336)
• Australia
27 Oct 07
I don't deny the fact that many people adapt to a life of poverty with no luxuries at all... and find their happiness from the simple things in life.
They do it because they have no other choice... but that don't make them any richer.
The great thing about human nature is that we are able to adapt to any circumstance in order to survive.
But life should not be about survival... but about quality of life. What is the point of living if your only concern is to remain alive for the sake of living. Surely... you want more out of life than a daily bol of rice for 70 years.

@seahorse4445 (639)
• United States
28 Sep 07
I do agree that positive thinking helps but you must also apply action to this. You can't just sit around and think positive thoughts. You have to have a plan of action.
1 person likes this
@Aussies2007 (5336)
• Australia
28 Sep 07
The point of it is that those people in Bourke did not choose to be poor.
They got caught in a situation "the drought" which did send them broke.
Now the positive thinker will tell us that the solution is simple. Move to a big city and get a job.
Those people are born on the land and most of them are farm hands. They cannot adapt overnight to the lifestyle of a big city... nor do they have the skills to get a decent job in a big city.
"Move to a big city and get a job" takes 5 seconds to think about it. To put it in practice takes months if you don't have what it takes. And for many people... it is just all too much.
@NewbieHelper (308)
• Canada
30 Oct 07
How many people do you really think are CHOOSING to be poor?
It is a nearly global but erroneous idea that those who are poor have somehow caused this financial state THEMSELVES...
...a dozen intricate factors can be at work that affect a person's financial situation - and the next person suffering in poverty can have a dozen OTHER conditions - none of which relate to or are like the 'poor' person right next to him or her.
Who, in their right mind, or outside of any deep-held moral beliefs would simply choose to live in poverty?
1 person likes this

@christineli (524)
• Philippines
28 Sep 07
I don't think that poverty is just a state of the mind. When your stomach complains of poverty, when you don't have roof over your head to shelter your from rain or the cold of night, when you feel the cold deep in your bones because you don't have enough thick clothes, then that is poverty and it's so real, far from being imaginary.
@academic2 (7000)
• Uganda
2 Oct 07
Poverty is indeed the lack critical thinking to disentangle ones'self from poverty situaton. people who think get what they want inorder to conquer poverty-those who are at the end of their thinking capacity to harness wealth will obviously miss out!
@cutepenguin (6430)
• Canada
9 Oct 07
I think poverty is definitely a very real thing, and not something that you can 'think your way out of'. I have, however, met people who insisted things like that there were no poor people in America. Of course, these were people who were on vacation in Europe, so they were definitely not poor.
Positive thinking can help, but I think money, new skills, and luck would be more of a solution.
@Aussies2007 (5336)
• Australia
9 Oct 07
The only people who will tell you that poverty is "a state of mind" are those who had the good fortune of being able to succeed. They never stop to think for a minute that not everyone has the same opportunities.
There are different level of poverty. And it has to be measured according to the living standard of your own country. Not to the living standard of third world countries.
In our society... it is not acceptable to be poor to the point of not having a roof over your head, not having electricity, a phone and a television. And those things cost money. In many cases... people will go hungry in order to pay the rent because they don't want to find themself in the street.
We actually have a poverty line... and we often refer to people living under the poverty line.
There are 36 million poor people in the US and about 10 million of them are under that poverty line.
@Perry2007 (2229)
• Philippines
13 Oct 07
I was just reading a book about the power of positive thinking and I learned about the Law of attraction thing. It worked for me. Well it's not like you just think about it but it is energy we are driving to work towards the things we like to happen. If everything we see around us are made of energy including us. Thought is pure energy. so we actually have what it takes to create anything we want to create.

@Perry2007 (2229)
• Philippines
14 Oct 07
How could you even be motivated to learn the how and get any capital down to use on anythihg. If you haven't even thought about it?
@Aussies2007 (5336)
• Australia
13 Oct 07
Thoughts are cheap. Everyone is capable to think and dream of what they would like to do.
Putting it in practice is another story.
First you need the know how... to do it.
And more often than not... it requires capital that you don't have to get you started.

@eaforeman6 (8979)
• United States
18 Oct 07
Thoughts without actions do not work.....Just like faith without works....We have to study and learn so that we can make them work together. There is a way to plan to change things and to make them better. I dont think anyone can expect over night results. Its takes budgeting and becoming a good financial manager to see long term results. You cant have it all now and be saving for the future too, savings has to be established so that more isnt going out the back door then what is coming in the front door.
@izathewzia (5134)
• Philippines
3 Oct 07
Maybe yes, because our mind controls our physical condition. It really depends what are your basis of categorizing people as poor. If you base it on money and people don't have any then he or she is poor. If you base it on having a simple, happy and loving family and people have broken families then they are poor. it really depends.









