The things we do for God ....
By grandpa_lash
@grandpa_lash (5225)
Australia
March 5, 2009 3:48am CST
There have been any number of discussions in this arena bashing Islam for the things religious fanatics do in that religion, but how about this piece of obscenity from the catholic church.
[b][i]A nine-year-old girl who was carrying twins, allegedly after being raped by her stepfather, has undergone an abortion despite complaints from Brazil's Roman Catholic church.
Police said the stepfather has been jailed since last week.
Abortion is illegal in Brazil, but judges can make exceptions if the mother's life is in danger or the fetus has no chance of survival.
Fatima Maia, director of the public university hospital where the abortion was performed, said the 15-week-old pregnancy posed a serious risk to the 36-kilogram girl.
"She is very small. Her uterus doesn't have the ability to hold one, let alone two children," Maia told the Jornal do Brasil newspaper.
But Marcio Miranda, a lawyer for the Archdiocese of Olinda and Recife in northeastern Brazil, said the girl should have carried the twins to term and had a cesarean section.
"It's the law of God: Do not kill. We consider this murder," Miranda said in comments reported by O Globo.[/i] [/b]
It's not only the Catholics who hold this obscene view on abortion, but many of the American style Protestant sects and cults also.
How is it possibly a sign of a loving God to condemn an abused 9 yo child to either certain death or dangerous (at her age) and intrusive surgery for the sake of nothing more than a MAN-made religious scruple?
Lash
4 people like this
13 responses
@James72 (26790)
• Australia
5 Mar 09
This is beyond tragic and a ridiculous stance on behalf of the Archidiocese as well. They should be providing solace to this child, not condemning her! Is it not a more powerful statement to be standing behind this poor little girl and showing mercy? Is it not a powerful act of forgiveness by supporting this little girl AFTER the abortion has been performed also? This is no better than missionaries going into third world countries and telling the people in them that using birth control is a sin! What is the greater evil overall then?
These so called breaches of theological ideals, or the outcome they end up producing with their outdated and closed minds? Though shalt not kill, sure. But surely turning the other cheek to a situation such as this is equally as important! And as far as I was aware, God forgives all? Did this change? What do they think is going to happen if they support this girl's abortion decision? Do they think that this will mean that female Catholics throughout Brazil will suddenly go on an abortion frenzy??? If this WAS the case, it says a lot about their opinions of the collective intelligence of their flock doesn't it! I never cease to be amazed at how selective factions of religions can be when it comes to interpreting texts and enforcing their supposed meanings. 
I wish every blessing imagineable for this little girl.
I wish every blessing imagineable for this little girl. 1 person likes this
@James72 (26790)
• Australia
5 Mar 09
My apologies! I just realized that I seperated my paragraph's at the wrong point.... The combined statement I wished to make should flow on as follows:
"What is the greater evil overall then? These so called breaches of theological ideals, or the outcome they end up producing with their outdated and closed minds?"
1 person likes this
@James72 (26790)
• Australia
5 Mar 09
"Thou shalt not be mysogynistic" must have been a commandment that was accidentally dropped on the way down the mountain then! 
But yes, I do agree with this angle as well in many instances. Modernisation in terms of lines of thought and theological practicality is way behind on many more fronts than just this one unfortunately.
But yes, I do agree with this angle as well in many instances. Modernisation in terms of lines of thought and theological practicality is way behind on many more fronts than just this one unfortunately. 1 person likes this
@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
5 Mar 09
Your syntactical error would have gone unnoticed lol.
Much as she can get a bit boring on the subject, I think sharra's response is fairly accurate. In both Christian and Islamic responses (and, it should be noted, among small factions of both Hinduism and Judaism, to say nothing of the evangelical American sects) there still appears to be a strong anti-female stance.
But it's nice that so far the responses to this discussion have mostly been kindred spirits.
Lash
2 people like this
@p1kef1sh (45681)
•
5 Mar 09
Very sad and demonstrates a typically closed minded literal doctrinal translation of the Church's teachings. I am very interested in mediaeval history; but wouldn't want to be subject to the laws and conventions of that time. Unfortunately, when it comes to religion, time seems to have stood still in so many ways. I am broadly of the view that children should be born. But I am not anti-abortion and I think that the circumstances need to be taken into account. This is exactly such an occasion. The problem is that people take a 1st century document - the complete Bible - and apply it to modern life literally.
1 person likes this
@p1kef1sh (45681)
•
5 Mar 09
Edward VI! Why he's almost modern. Funnily enough he features large in my Cathedral guiding. In his attempts to ensure the rise of Protestantism in England he had no objections to the desecration of tombs and memorials in cathedrals and churches. In fact he quite encouraged it. We have a number of tombs where the effigies of the commemorated had been sliced off laterally. No, I don't know her work. I shall have a look in the library. We have the tomb of Katherine Grey, sister to Lady Jane Grey, Edward's successor for an ill-fated nine days before she was executed to make way for Mary Tudor, a Roman Catholic. She was replaced by her sister Elizabeth 1 who of course oversaw the repeal of Mary's Catholic policies and paved the way for Protestant Lutherism albeit within a traditional mould. I.e it looked familiar but felt very different.
1 person likes this
@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
5 Mar 09
Another kindred spirit. sharra and I share your view on abortion, and on church inadequacies.
Apropos of something altogether off subject, have you come across the Kate Sedley books? Her hero is Roger the Chapman, an amateur sleuth, and they are set in the time of Edward the 6th. We're finding them quite enjoyable.
Lash
1 person likes this
@maximax8 (31053)
• United Kingdom
5 Mar 09
I have heard of another country in the Americas where abortion is illegal allowing a young incest victim to have an abortion. So it seems that where the mother's life is considered to be in danger some of these countries allow abortion when it usually illegal. The Catholic religion is at odds to the idea of allowing abortion. It seems that regarding the 9 year old Brazilian girl opinions differed. I would have suggested she carried her twins until the medical people said a c-section could be done. Then the twins would have survived and they could have been adopted to a loving family. I am not religious but don't agree with abortions. I think of aborted babies as being the lost people of the world. I think a fetus is innocent. However the girl who was very young didn't consult to a serious relationship she was a victim of incest. I would like to see the number of abortions for social reasons reduced but I realize that in cases where the mother's life is in danger and she is a minor that is an unusual and difficult case. Religion can have a strong bearing on how the laws in a country are arranged.
1 person likes this
@theonerm5 (365)
• United States
6 Mar 09
I'd have to say I'd do anything for God as long as I knew it was what he really wanted.
@renemouche (843)
• United States
5 Mar 09
This is crazy. This story is so sad. Im catholic. I would not choose abortion for myself but I would not take away the right of someone else to choose that route.
This poor 9 year old girl. Abortion was the only way. I hope she and her family can be healed from this sitution. This "Stepfather" needs to be put under the jail.
You are right every religious faith and demonation has radical factions, people need to recognize that.
@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
6 Mar 09
I'm glad that you, as a Catholic, agree with the course of action. But I should point out that this stance on the abortion is not from a radical stream of Catholicism, it is a mainstream Catholic policy, as is the prohibition against contraception, both policies I consider extremist.
Lash
1 person likes this
@renemouche (843)
• United States
6 Mar 09
yeah I know that its a mainstream Catholic point-of-view but alot of Catholic's I know dont share the churches view on abortion, birth control, etc... I just wanted to point out that not all Catholics have a pro-life point of view.
@shemb1 (464)
• Sri Lanka
6 Mar 09
strongly hated these kind of animal human live in this world. But what to do can we kill all of these kind of animal? thats why the law has to be stand on the right and the correct time.
In my point of view this is not a thing that related to religion. I say whatever religon we follow it will state on the way we practice on that. Some people do go to their religious places because they thought 'we have to go'. not in big reason go as a part of weekly habbit. some do for porpose. some do pratice without going and do the right thing on right time...
So end of the day we need people who really not spoiled in our society. that what religon has to do.
Anyway this topic is really sad thing but I cant say the abortion has to be do or not. sometimes things has to be done , because it shouldnt happend in wrong time. I know it is bad. But end of the who we panising? i mean society that bad man or girl? of course law will panish that man....
but mentality of society will panish that girl's whole future life.. in sake of that if things has taken that is not matter. it is helps for her to me. This is not mentality of normal girl.. This is kids mentality i am talking about.
@zandi458 (28102)
• Malaysia
6 Mar 09
Violent end to an innocent life, one which is biologically half the own child of its mother, is no answer to pregnancy caused by rape or incest or under-age relations. But abortion is accepted reluctantly at a time when that girl 's mind and body, even during the most normal pregnancy, both undergo significant additional stress. The needs of some cannot be allowed to eclipse the rights of others. The catholic church should take a soft stand on cases which deem necessary to save life of an under-age, in this case.
@miamilady (4910)
• United States
5 Mar 09
This is one of the reasons I am not a "practicing" Catholic. Although I still relate to the religion, I don't believe everything that their beliefs dictate.
@ketybhagat (4123)
• India
5 Mar 09
I strongly condemn the father who did this to his littl girl. Fatiama Maia did right in aborting the babies, thereby saving the child's life. Marcio Miranda can yell at the top of his voice, who cares. What had to be done had to be done, and a very wise thing. I dont think abortion is wrong when the reasons are right. I hope the little girl will be able to lead a normal life now, without people looking at her like a raare specimen. The world can be pretty cruel.
@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
5 Mar 09
Yes. I think we can take it as said, the perpetrator of this incident is a scumbag, and is now where he deserves to be. The point of the discussion, as you have illuminated, is the response of the Church.
Lash
1 person likes this
@NuttyMomma (901)
• United States
5 Mar 09
there are extremists in every religion. what about the "christians" who bomb abortion clinics. protesting killing by killing. hmmm. that's effective huh?
