Girls!!! Are you like this???

@calai618 (1773)
Philippines
October 20, 2009 10:40am CST
Me and my college bestfriend consider ourselves feminists mainly because we aim for equality. We want men and women to be treated fairly and without any bias. We are both strong-willed women and sort of independent. We believe we can do stuff men does, etc. But then, we are very much guilty of small crimes which might negate what we think of ourselves..These "crimes" I am talking about are enjoying "ladies first", requiring men to "give their seats (or place) to the ladies" and taking advantage of the "ladies only train", among others. Do you think we are being inconsistent? How do you define being a feminist? Do you consider yourself one? DO you also enjoy the perks exclusively for girls? Now I am really confused hehe...
6 people like this
27 responses
• United States
20 Oct 09
I don't consider myself a feminist, but I do believe that men and women are equal. I do not think that gender has as much to do with how people are different as the way they are raised, and personal strengths and weaknesses. My family tried to raise me "girlie", but they gave up after a short peroid of time because I just didn't like all the stereo-typical "girlie" things. During the recent tornado clean-up, my oldest daughter and I were outside working with all the guys and holding our own. At first the guys weren't sure about us, but they quickly accepted us when they saw us jump right in and start doing the physical labor. I don't think that I take advantage of "exclusively for girl" perks, either. I like it when a guy holds the door for me, but if I get there first I will hold the door for a guy, too. I think these things are common courtesy and should be done for everybody. I don't think there are a lot of guys that will hold the door for other guys, but they shouldn't let it drop their faces, either, like I have seen some do. When I was pregnant I did take a seat from a guy, but other than that I won't. I have offered other people my seat, though, when I saw that they were injured or had a disability. I think it works both ways, and that is the only way to truly be equal.
2 people like this
@Hatley (163781)
• Garden Grove, California
20 Oct 09
hi wish I could have worded my response so well. you do make such good sense. have not seen you around lately. You said all the things I wanted to say but could not get my morning brain to function that well.
• United States
20 Oct 09
Thank you very much, Hatley. I have been missing for a little while and am working on a discussion to explain my absense. I really dislike the term "feminist", because it implies that we have to prove our equality, which I don't think we need to do. We are not all the same, but we all should be equal. I believe that if we all treat each other the way we would like to be treated, then the world would be a much nicer and happier place to live.
1 person likes this
• United States
21 Oct 09
Actually, Angelajoy, generally males might be physically stronger than women, but not all men are stronger than women, so we don't just need to deal with that fact. Right now I am not at my peak, because I did have a baby and had to deal with physical complications from that, but I can still curl 25 pounds with one arm, which really is about average. When I am back to normal, though, I curl 50 pounds with one arm, which is a lot more than the average man curls. I know this, because I have been challenged to prove it many times, since they didn't believe I could do it when they couldn't, especially since I am defined and muscular but not grotesquely so. Generally women are not as strong as guys because of the way they are brought up and the work that they do. If a women does physical labor, plays sports, etc., then she can be just as strong or stronger than the average male. It also depends on body type and chemical make-up, because there are some guys and girls that will just never be as strong as others due to their physical and chemical composition. On the other hand, there are both guys and girls that are naturally stronger and more muscular than others, which is why they tend to excel at physical activities without as much effort.
@JohnJeff (720)
• Malaysia
21 Oct 09
I think it's little bit discrimination for man.I you trying to say you hate man.Well, actually man and girl have the same right to living on erath in harmony.Maybe you have bad experiance with man and give bad impression about man.Have a nice day.
@calai618 (1773)
• Philippines
21 Oct 09
No not at all. Our views are in no way to discriminate men rather to elevate women's rights and roles to the same level of men. I share the same belief as you about men and women having the same right to living on this earth and I aim for this equality to go further like reducing,if not ommiting, gender-specific roles, biases, etc. Thanks for the response!
• Bangladesh
25 Oct 09
womend discriminations.......not good for soceity
@cripfemme (7698)
• United States
4 Nov 09
I am a feminist, too. I admit to liking the "girls only perks" too. The problems, for me, though is that if we always silently accept these privileges all the time, men might think we incapable of doing basic things like opening doors,
@mipen2006 (5528)
• Australia
20 Oct 09
Hi calai, I'm an old fashioned person, and I was taught it manners to give up your seat for a lady, and let ladies go first. I also believe that it's the job that should be valued, not the person doing it, so I believe in equal pay. However, I think you want your cake and want to eat it too. You must be reasonably. I hope you're not like some Thai university students who pretended to be asleep when I was standing, after a full day teaching. I was 65 then, and those students, in their early twenties didn't impress me.
@calai618 (1773)
• Philippines
21 Oct 09
Hi mipen2006! Thank you for the response. i could not agree more about the "job issue". There should not be any gender specific job rather if someone is capable of doing it, let him or her. I also think that what those Thai students did to you is not country-specific as well. I am sure there are tons of those type all over the world. I am petite and frail but if a situation calls for me to give up my seat, I do it and it's such a pain to see stronger people (both men and women) around me pretending not to care. Like you said, it's manners and that's what has been thought since forever and they haven't learned obviously.
@Hatley (163781)
• Garden Grove, California
20 Oct 09
hi calai618 Well here in Orange county Ca it is first come first gets the seat, and I have never seen a man give up his seat for me until I became handicapped, then it was always a much older man. the young ones just sprawled their legs out in the aisles and made it very evident they gave up seats to nobody. I as an older woman feel myself very much a feminist in that women are equal to men, and should be paid accordingly and I open my own doors, and seat my own self. But I also am not above being pleased inwardedly when a man does open a door for me, or helps me with my packages.
• United States
20 Oct 09
I agree that it makes me feel good when a guy opens the door for me, but I feel equally pleased when a woman holds the door open for me. I think it makes us all feel good to be respected and treated with kindness regardless of our gender. I also think it is a shame that the younger generation does not seem to have the same respect for others that the older generation usually has.
• United States
20 Oct 09
You can still be a feminist and still be a lady. There is nothing wrong with that. The main goal here is to not be submissive to men. That does not mean that you cannot be treated like a lady. It just means that you cannot be mistreated in the normal stereotypical ways such as discrimination.
@calai618 (1773)
• Philippines
25 Oct 09
Thank you so much for the wonderful post, maggemorgan! It was brief and concise..very meaningful. It explained a lot to me.
@Angelwriter (1954)
• United States
24 Oct 09
I could argue with so many things posted here,but instead I will just answer the original post. First, I'm a feminist. Have been, even though I probably didn't know the word then, since I was 5. As far as the "crimes" I don't require a man to give me his seat or open the door. Don't ask for it, don't demand it. But, if a man offers, I don't feel my feminist creds are damaged if I accept. How does being offered a seat make someone less equal than the person offering it? How does going through a door that someone holds open make a person less worthy of the rights to fulfill whatever their potential is and to be treated as human beings? Which, by the way, is my definition of equality and what I base my feminism on. Here's a scenario. If a woman offers her seat to a man and he accepts, would his intelligence and strength relative to hers and right to work he was capable of doing and being judged as an individual based on his character and not his gender suddenly disappear? If a man says, "I will be courteous to a woman in the same manner I am to a man, but I won't have gender specific actions in how I treat you" then that's wonderful. That's an attitude I have no issue with. It's a totally different animal if a man -or woman for that matter- says that accepting these things veto their right to equality. Especially since human beings in general enjoy perks whether based on gender or status or who they know or a million other examples all the time.
@kezabelle (2974)
21 Oct 09
I think rather it makes you a little hypocritical if you want equality then try opening a door for a man once in a while! What annoys me though is I am quite old fashioned I think women should stay at home with their children etc and I like being treated like a lady people laugh when I tell people that yet if a MAN said it they would get called all sorts of things!!! Everyone has their different views and those should be respected even if you dont agree with them because everyone has a right to that. I dont EVER force my veiws on anyone else i have friends who work etc and I respect them for that because for them it is the best way to bring up their family and so on but it simply isnt right for me and my family. Can you be a femenist and enjoy the perks of being female? Hell yeh just dont preach about equality whilst expecting a man to pay hold doors and treat you like a lady because quite frankly i think its a pretty bad impressi9on to give someone, surely both parts can live along side but seperatley if that makes sense!
@mommyboo (13174)
• United States
1 Nov 09
I don't think I'm a feminist, I am an 'equalist' meaning that I consider both genders equal and equally deserving of anything based ONLY on experience, skills, knowledge, determination, personality, etc. Obviously men cannot bear children but I don't take physical differences into account to the point where it 'disables' someone from being able to do something another person can. I believe that either gender can do ANY job equally effectively, and either gender should ALWAYS get equal opportunity. I disagree with affirmative action or catering to any group because of issues in the past or because someone believes they are a 'discrimated against minority'. I too agree with treating every PERSON equally, fairly, and without bias. I am very independent too. As far as some of the things you bring up that may sound counter-productive, I don't necessarily believe in ladies first. Now I DO believe in allowing men to engage in chivalrous behavior, which include things like opening doors for you, letting you walk in first, be seated first, perhaps picking up the check. If they WANT to do these things for you, I think it is rude to argue with them about it lol. However, I don't think everybody should expect EVERY MAN to behave this way, there are a lot of louts and entitled creatures wandering about, and some of them have been raised this way. I really believe that people need to stand on their own merit, that it is not a gender war. If your behavior dictates someone wants to take care of you, let them, that is respectful. If your behavior doesn't, then don't expect them to. Does that make sense?
@bhanusb (5709)
• India
23 Oct 09
I'm a male. I think the feminists are wrongly explained. Those women fight for the establishment of female rights and gender equality they are called feminists.Every work can't do a woman for her physical reason. So she should not try to do that work.The words "ladies first" are pity for woman. In the name of 'feminist' women should not take extra advantage like "ladies only train".Maternity glorify a woman.
@andy77e (5156)
• United States
25 Oct 09
I'm shocked. You give me hope just by the fact you are willing to take an objective look at yourself. Too many seem to want it both ways, and every way. I hope I am granted the privileged to meet more wise and intelligent women.
• United States
21 Oct 09
That's kind of a tough question. Like you, I beleive men and women are equal and should be treated that way. But also like you, I enjoy chivalry. Hmmm... Years ago the only goal women had in life was to find a suitable husband. Her career and such was just "something to do." I think a woman should make herself the priority and if a great man enters her world, that's great. But if he doesn't, than that's okay too because she is able to take care of herself. I hope that makes sense...lol.
• Bangladesh
25 Oct 09
good post
@MJAL08 (275)
1 Nov 09
"ladies first" is a courtesy men gives to us. I guess no. Equality means, don't treat women weak because we can do what men can. Men aren't better than us and we are no better than them. I guess that's equality.
@paula27661 (15811)
• Australia
21 Oct 09
I believe that there are men and there are women and we are all equal as human beings but there are differences. Men and women are different and should balance each other out. A lady can demand equality and respect and still enjoy having a man take care of her and a man can still take pride in treating a woman like a lady. I think that it is a matter of balance and it is fine for women to demand equality but let us not forget that males and females are not the same and never will be! It is a matter of having respect for one another I think...
• India
21 Oct 09
when u see or meet a girl you like make brief eye contact and smile ,stike up a casual conservation.most importantly ,relax.the more you talk togirls ,the more relaxed you become .dont think of her as the girl of ur dream;dont worry about what will happen if you make a bad joke,or if you have something stuck to your teeth.(besides if she like you,she probably worrying about the exact same thing)enjoy interacting with this attractive,friendly girl whose path crossed urs.live in the moment.just make sure not to go over the top when fliriting .girls tend to do this morethan the guys.but dont get caught up in the moment that you say or do something you might regret later
@fezman (260)
• Australia
21 Oct 09
im not female but my partner is! and one thing that has always bewildered me is the fact that every couple (man\woman) some time in their life always has an argument about leaving the toilet seat up! if you put some un bias thought into it, its actually more of a hassle for men! because when its up, you can use even your foot to put it down, but when its down, just try to use your foot to put it up then! its also a courtesy thing that we put it up because we could just pee all over the seat. i guess this is a debate that could go on forever! and one other perk women do get is the fact that you can wear shorts\dresses\jeans and skirts and still look fantastic in them all, i dont think men look so hot when wearing some of these items!
@mielshare (265)
• Philippines
21 Oct 09
I don't consider my self as a feminist. I want to be treated equally of course but in a sense that I'm not over reacting about it.. But I think what you are doing is just right just make sure you don't step guy's ego cause that would be a different issue.
@aking888 (66)
• China
21 Oct 09
belief in the social,political,and economic equality of the sexes.someone who does not believe in hte social or economic or politicak equality of men and woman.in upholding the principle of equality between men adn women,China believes this concepts not only of women but also the full employment of the wisdom of humanity of social productive forces.
@Skydance (26)
• Australia
21 Oct 09
there is no absolute equality between men and women all we are persuing is just relative quality ps: i would think the lady first things as a culture or custom rather than bias