teacher doesnt want to show her records...

@p3ks626 (6538)
Philippines
June 22, 2010 3:04am CST
A few days ago, I made a discussion about my friend who failed one of his classes because the teacher intentionally did it. Today, my friend went to see that teacher and ask an explanation why he failed, but the doesnt want to show the records. My friend knows that he passed but he was failed because the teacher said it was his attitude that failed him. What do you think? Do you think the teacher is right to fail him just because my friend had an attitude? He complied with all the requirements anyway.
4 people like this
22 responses
@qianyun6 (2067)
• China
22 Jun 10
Obviously the teacher has the right, otherwise you friend was passed now. In all of my lessons in university, I said to myself again and again, never offend against the teacher. Teachers can easily find a reasonable excuse to cover the real ridiculous reason and let you fail. Attitude? WTF!
2 people like this
@qianyun6 (2067)
• China
22 Jun 10
"was" should be "had", I'm sorry!
2 people like this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
Both the student and the teacher have the right but its not her right to refuse the student's request because those are the student's records. To be credible of what she did, she has to show some documents or even records that will prove that the student really failed. And yes! Talking about the attitude, its not because teachers are teachers they are always right. Students can actually voice out if they know that something is wrong. You can even correct your teacher is she made a mistake in her class. The teacher is not the king or queen of the classroom. People who think about the four corners of the classroom that way, should study in the primeval period. Teacher of course have the power to fail or pass the student as long as its reasonable enough. But failing my friend for always speaking his mind, is not reason enough. I am a teacher by profession. I taught in the university and I had so many students whom I should say, I the attitude. They disagree about the things I teach in my class, some of them are rude too, but I didnt fail them because they deserve to pass. I failed one student though, and its not because of his attitude, its because he was always absent and I never passed any of my requirements. If my friend is like that, then I dont have the reason to take his side.
1 person likes this
@amelly (1554)
• Malaysia
22 Jun 10
if that is the case..than maybe the smart students can also failed cuz ya know..not all smart students has a nice attitude..believe me..being part of the students in a boardings school taught me a lot bout people personality..a few of my friends also is like having a 'personality disorder' cuz we can't expect what they will do and sometimes they act weird....well,back to the teachers..they should not do that..supposedly the attitude does matter but in this case..your friend is a victim because just because of his attitude..he got bad thing..that is unfair and so not professional for a teacher to do that..
1 person likes this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
He was the only one who failed! The teacher even passed the student who wasnt able to pass the requirements. I also think that the teacher is too irrational. Like you said, very unprofessional. I am a teacher by profession and I have taught students with different personalities but I never failed them because they did not agree to my discussions in class. They have the right to do that. And definitely students have the right to look at the teacher's records. I feel bad for the teacher though because she wasnt able to take things constructively.
1 person likes this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
Yeah! It was his records he was asking for and not the other student's records. The teacher said she cant show it to him. We were thinking that she did something to the records so that my friend would fail. I also think she didnt record his score in the preliminary examination.
@amelly (1554)
• Malaysia
22 Jun 10
yes..and why don't your friend report to someone in charge?i mean what is her problam anyway..she can;t just do that..this is against the right of the student..he just ask for his records..not others..
1 person likes this
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
I think that is pretty unfair of the teacher, to be biased against your friend because of personal issues and not because of grades. Unfortunately, there are teachers who do that. A classmate of mine experienced that but it was really hard to fight against the teacher. How about telling the incident to the principal or dean?
1 person likes this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
That's the reason why I am taking my friend's side because the teacher's basis for failing him has something to do with personal matters rather than what really make a student pass. I dont think students dont have the right to voice out what they think is right. Teachers also dont have the right to say that students should just believe in anything that they say just because they are the teachers. We are planning to make a complain against that teacher. Whether he really passed or not, whether there is a possibility that his grade will be changed, the teacher needs to show some records that will serve as a proof for my friends failure. And one more thing, we also discovered that the teacher passed one of the students who was not able to comply with the requirements. How bad is that?
1 person likes this
• Malaysia
22 Jun 10
It is a very bad practice and if it goes on it will tarnish the good image of the teaching profession. Students beg exam marks from teachers and teachers take advantage to punish students they don't seem quite like by giving them failed marks.
1 person likes this
@yresh12 (3212)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
HI P3 You should tell your friend to go to the dean if the teacher won't show him where he passed. Yes, teachers have the right to fail the student. I think that your friend should know what attitude did the teacher mean. Maybe the teacher was just very annoyed or bear grudges with your friend. I hope that it will be okay soon. Take care.
1 person likes this
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
No teacher can do something like that. they shouldn't do it at all. it isn't fair one bit. i hope they fire that teacher for being Bias, she should be fair to all students.
1 person likes this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
No matter what kind of attitude the student has, the teacher doesnt have the right to fail him just because he has an attitude. Last time I checked, we are still a democratic country and no one can actually prevent you from saying what is it that you wanted to say. The teacher is too unprofessional for taking things personally. Let's say she is annoyed by my friends attitude but those are not grounds of failure in class.
1 person likes this
@yresh12 (3212)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
Hi p3 We are a democratic country and we have limitations. :) I personally don't know what's the problem but the teacher will most likely fail a student. They have their grading system and If your friend broke the rules well it's the teachers prerogative to fail or not. Being annoyed is another one. If that's the case the teacher should not base the grades on that. Every thing goes with a process and they should follow that.
1 person likes this
@juggerogre (1653)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
If from the start the teacher already told her class that attitude is also graded then I think the teacher has the right to fail your friend. If not then this is a matter that needs to be escalated to someone higher than the teacher. This would be very unprofessional for the teacher. Show proof that your friend failed. If not then the at least she will pass your friend.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
That's exactly what we want her to do. Show some sort of proof that my friend actually failed but she doesnt want to show her records. She just said that she knows her records and that my friend actually failed. But it not enough evidence, it should be written. I dont care now whether she is going to pass my friend in her class, as long as she will be able to provide some sort of proof then we cant do anything about it. As a teacher, I dont think attitude is ever part of the grading system. No teacher can tell the students on the attitude that they need to have in their classes. No teacher can change the kind of attitude a student should have just to show the students who's boss in the classroom. And students pay the teachers, the students are somewhat the bread and butter of the teachers so I think its still the student's right to request anything from the teacher. I hope everything will be okay. I dont think its ever worth it if my friend would have to retake that subject when in fact its a minor subject of all minor subjects.
1 person likes this
@elvieb02 (695)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
I disagree on you on that part that attitude is not a part of grading system. We are teacher because we teach and mold them. It is not right to say that the student is the bread and butter of the teacher. The student pay the teacher because they need to learn. Maybe your friend has offended the teacher so much. If that's the case, the teacher has the right to fail him as he did not pass to the teacher's requirement. Whatever requirement the teacher may say that your friend didn't pass, you would not know, as not all teachers as basing their grading system in numbers. Your friend can file a formal complaint against the teacher so that both parties can explain themselves. If your friend really thinks that he passed the course, then he should write a complaint letter address to the dean/principal ( i don't know if your friend is in high school or college), then the teacher will be summoned to show your friends record and explain.
1 person likes this
@elvieb02 (695)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
Oh, and by the way, minor subjects are still required, it doesn't mean that you should not take them seriously because if you don't pass it, you cannot still graduate. All subjects, may it be minor or major should be taken seriously.
1 person likes this
@elvieb02 (695)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
Your friend has the right to see his record. If the teacher doesn't want, your friend can go to the principal/dean and complain so that the teacher will comply on showing his record. Your friend must also have his record of his exam papers as a proof. Attitude alone cannot be the reason to get a fail grade.
1 person likes this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
Exactly what I mean! Its the teacher's job to make the record and if possible be able to explain why my friend failed. She didnt want to show the records to him. I think the reason for that is she really made some adjustments with his grades so that the teacher would have some basis about his failure. My friend will not be able to show his papers though because he threw it away already. But he's pretty sure he passed the exams, the subject was not really something, its the most basic of all subjects.
1 person likes this
@elvieb02 (695)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
that's why it is always important to keep exam results until you get your grade so that you can argue with the teacher since you have evidence since exams is basically 60% in the grading system and 20% for the attitude and attendance and another 20% for participation, projects and others.
1 person likes this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
You are right about that! But the only thing we can do now is to look at the teacher's record and make her explain why my friend failed.
@_sketch_ (5742)
• United States
24 Jun 10
The teacher was definitely out of line. A similar thing happened to me when I was a freshman in highschool. The teacher was a total pervert and there was a petition a guy started to get him removed, which didn't work by the way; actually the guy got suspended and I almost did because I was the second or third name on the petition. Anyway, the jerk didn't like me and I got a B in that class...until the next year I got my transcripts and somehow it was an F. I ended up having to pay like a hundred bucks for a packet to get my credit for that course. I'm sick of people abusing the power they never should've been given in the first place. But whatever, I know the truth.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
25 Jun 10
Sorry to hear that! But you are right about that anyway, no matter what, you know that truth. My friend already talked to the head of that school and I still dont have updates so far. I should tell him what you said here. We are really disappointed because the teacher is so unprofessional.
@andy77e (5156)
• United States
24 Jun 10
Well there are two sides to this. First, should a teacher be able to fail a student for reason other than the specific work completed? Generally no. I say generally because there are some schools where they try and teach you things other than simply basic knowledge. In those schools, yes, you can, and will, be failed for things beyond test scores and work requirements. But generally, no. However, the other side of this, is important. Sometimes people doing wrong things, can still teach you an important lesson. Attitude is very very important. It's a life skill that can effect every part of your future. I know people who have great work ethic, great performance... but a horrible attitude. They never get promoted, never get a pay raise, never advance in life... because of attitude. This teacher, even while doing something wrong, showed your friend a life lesson. You might by the best worker in the whole company, but if the boss sees you have a bad attitude, you may will get fired. I've seen people fired, who were great at what they did, but they had a bad attitude. I've seen girls who complained they never meet any nice guys, yet they have a horrible attitude. No good guy likes a girl with a bad attitude. So the only guys that come around are other guys with bad attitudes. Then she complains she never meets any good guys. You attitude can effect every aspect of your life. Controlling it, and learning that, could be the best lesson your friend learns from this wrong teacher.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
25 Jun 10
You have a point there. But anyway, I am also hoping that my friend learned something from this experience. The teacher may or may not change his grade but I hope both of them will know where they made a mistake and recognize it and try to do something about it.
@hexeduser22 (7253)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
If the subject or the course is about moral values then I think the teacher have a right to fail your friend but if it isn't then the teacher should be transparent with it and show her untampered records
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
24 Jun 10
The subject is nothing like that at all. I would also understand if the subject is about good manners and right conduct or values education, but it is not so I guess its not appropriate at all.
• China
23 Jun 10
Last semester one of my teacher also warned us that if our learning attitude is bad, he would fail us. And though I think he does not have the right, I think it is good for students to learn to have good attitude which is not only important in school but also important in society. Attitude sometimes represent one's respect for others and one's morality. So I think it will be better for your friend to change his bad attitude instead of complaining or arguing whether the teacher has the right to fail him.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
24 Jun 10
Even if you look at every angle of his case, we can still go down to the conclusion that the teacher really doesnt have the right to fail him or other teachers to fail students because of having a bad attitude. Its about dealing with individual differences. If you deal with things like in this in a very professional way then personal things are not taken into consideration. Maybe in your country, teachers are really the kings and queens of the classroom. And that kind of teaching strategy is maybe the old style but its the modern days now. We cant expect students to agree with everything that the teacher says. As a student, you have the right to voice out your opinion. I am a teacher by profession, I taught in the university and I also had an experience teaching high school students. There were students who were rude, they didnt agree with everything that I say. But I didnt take it personally because that would be unfair for the student if I did because he is really going to fail if I considered his attitude. But attitude is not the basis of all grades, its not the only thing the teacher should consider for the students grade. There are more and everything should be considered. If the teacher focuses more on attitude and values, then he or she should be teaching values education and none else.
@baban88 (103)
• Philippines
24 Jun 10
i agree coz teachers are our 2nd parents and what ever happens to us inside the school we are their responsibility, and its their responsibility to teach us some good morals and lead us into the right path. . .=]
@Cutie18f (9551)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
I think the student has the right to know why he failed. He can ask to see his record and the teacher is obliged to show everything to justify the failure. If the teacher refuses to show his records, then the student should go to the principal or dean. If he is a minor, the student should bring his parents with him, but even college students would bring along their parents in cases like this. The teacher cannot keep his records secret. He has to be open to any queries.
1 person likes this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
I hope the teacher knows that fact but it seems that she doesnt. She actually refused to show the records. We were thinking she faked the records just to show that he had a failing mark. I hope we will be able to talk to the dean as soon as possible so we will be able to do to something about it.
@Suminundu (192)
• Malaysia
22 Jun 10
The student did not fail based on his attitude. I think his failure is based on the teacher's attitude.
1 person likes this
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
I think you are right about that! I could almost think now that the teacher is the one who has an attitude problem, not the student. She is so unprofessional because we also found out that there was one student who didnt comply with the requirements and she gave him a passing grade!
@Suminundu (192)
• Malaysia
22 Jun 10
I think the teacher isn't right to fail a student based on an attitude.Your friend did not fail based on her attitude but based on the teacher's attitude.
1 person likes this
@baban88 (103)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
uhm maybe the teacher is just trying to teach your friend a lesson and show your friends record eventually if he show some initiative, initiative like asking forgiveness to his teacher and try not to do it again maybe he offended his teacher badly for him/her not to show your friend's record or not to let him pass.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
It could be one of the reasons but the first time he approached the teacher, he was really nice. HE said if there was something that needs to be done but then again the teacher was the first one to say bad things about him. I also dont think that things like that should be taken personally. She's a teacher and she should have dealt with things professionally. She cant do that just because she was offended by the student. She also cant change his grades just to fail him. All I know is that the teacher is really unfair about this situation.
@baban88 (103)
• Philippines
24 Jun 10
hmm i think they should talk about it in a nice way, coz i believe everything will be settled by just talking it over.. . =]tell your friend.
@sid556 (30960)
• United States
23 Jun 10
Hi P3ks626, Your friend has every right to see his records and to get a straight answer as to why he failed. Attitude is not a reason to fail a person if they have met all the requirements. "Attitude" is too open to personal judgement and has nothing to do with academics. If your friend does in fact have a poor attitude then it will be his own lesson to learn when he is refused or loses jobs as a result of it. I come from a family of teachers and I know that even if in a particular class "attitude" counted toward part of a certain grade such as "participation"....it is only a fraction of the grade. He would have to fail all aspects of the class in order to fairly earn an "F". Your friend needs to go above the teachers head to the principal. If not satisfied there then he needs to go to the superintendent. He should not give up because not only will it hurt him...it will give this teacher the confidence to pull this on another student.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
I am aware about that fact that attitude is part of class participation cause I am also a teacher. It takes only 10% of your grade, so even if we say that he failed in class participation, the teacher still has 90% more for the basis of his grade. I dont think participation takes about 50 or 60 percent of the grade. I think its quite obvious that the teacher intentionally failed the student because of his attitude.
@TheAdvocate (2392)
• Philippines
22 Jun 10
It depends. When classes started, did the teacher give the breakdown as to where your grades will come from? If behavior is part of the grade, then bad luck for your friend. If not, your friend can appeal to the school administration. Grading a student should be left to the whims of the teacher. If it were, might as well give the teacher a dart board instead.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
She did say something about grading system like homework, major exams, attendance and class participation. Nothing about attitude because its not part of the whole thing. Let's say that behavior is a part of the grading system, I dont think it will take around 60% of the student's grade that will make it a very huge percentage in the final grade. I think its obvious that the problem has something to do with the teacher not with the student.
@jamed28 (1903)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
It is the RIGHT of the STUDENTS to know his/her records. If the teacher insisted that the reason for his/her failure was his/her attitude, then better yet ask the that teacher or any one in a higher position from that school, if attitude is really part of the grading system, just like exams, quizzes, attendance, reports, exercises and others. If it is part of the grading system then ask if how many percent does attitude contributes for the total grade. I was a teacher before so I know this things. I never hide my record from my students. I even ask them, if they have questions about their grades, I am pretty much welcome to show them my computations. Everytime I give them their grades, I don't just give them their final grades,I give them also it's break down. And yet in the school that I'd worked before, attitude is not part of the grading system. It is the teachers responsibility to handle and mold his students whatever their attitude is.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
As far as I know, and as a teacher, quizzes, exams, reports, homework, attendance and class participation are the only things included in the grading system. If attitude is part of the teacher's grading system, I dont think that the percentage of it is bigger than that of the things that needs to be complied by the students such as quizzes, major exams, etc. I am also a teacher and attitude was not part of our grading system. My friend is already in college so I dont think teachers are still going to mind about their behavior in class. Its okay to do that if they are in elementary or in high school.
@dian21 (606)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
It depends on the policy also of the school, if they have given the teachers the prerogative to fail the student because of attitude problem. But for me, from the schools that I've been,it's not right to fail a student just because of attitude problem. There is due process if it's the attitude. There is Guidance Counselling, and that's their role in the school. As long as the student is complying to all the requirements then attitude should be set aside and then settle it at the right time and place..So definitely, the teacher can't show the records because your friend really passed the subject.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
All schools have policies like that because they dont have the right to change the attitude of the student just because its going to be good for them and its going to be for the school's welfare. I also think that she faked his failure because she doesnt want to show the records. And if it was his attitude problem that was the teachers concern, she should have talked to my friend and not make moves by failing someone who deserves to pass.
@meaqan (69)
• United States
23 Jun 10
I don't believe that is actually allowed. I could be wrong but if he had the grades and was at school most days there should be no way he can fail. He should definetly go to someone with higher authority and straighten it out!
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
That's what he is doing now. There were times that he was also absent in class but there were more times that he was present. I also find it impossible that he failed because he was able to comply with the requirements. And it was even more unfair when we found out that the student who did not comply the requirements passed.
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
The teacher should have showed the student's records because it is his obligation to do so. There are certain criteria that are usually followed in giving grades. So he has to prove the student that his decision to fail him has a "legal" basis.
@p3ks626 (6538)
• Philippines
23 Jun 10
Exactly! All she said is she knows her records and she need not show it to my friend just to prove that he actually failed. But of course, we are not satisfied with that so we forwarded the concern to the dean. I do hope that the dean would listen to my friend. I know he passed, he cant fail because he did all the requirements.