Mistakes in the paragraph. WHO OR WHOM GRAMMAR
By CrimsonSpork
@Manasha (2933)
Pondicherry, India
February 24, 2013 11:56pm CST
I have come across the following sentences in a site and wanted to know the mistakes present in the sentences. Particularly, the use of who in the sentence and really confused with it. The use of who for the subject people is confusing me.
Our organization has over a decade of experience in marketing. We love people who we meet that are passionate about their business. But they crave growth. Success is with us is practically inevitable.
Our team shares passion. Being an integrated marketing agency, we have the ability to execute the creative work in many ways.
Please share the ideas .
5 responses
@owlwings (43897)
• Cambridge, England
25 Feb 13
'Who' is used as the subject of a verb (nominative case); 'whom' is used for the object (direct or indirect) of a verb ('whom': accusative case; 'of whom': genitive case; 'to/for whom': dative case; 'by/with/from whom': ablative case).
'Who'/'whom'/'whose' always refers to a person or a group of persons. 'Which' is used to refer to things/animals/inanimate objects. There is something of a 'grey area' when deciding which pronoun to use for an organisation or a company (which consists of a group of people). Really, a company, an organisation or a team is an inanimate thing, so one usually uses 'which':
"The business which has the biggest turnover"
"The company for which I work."
"The team of which I am a member."
"The organization to which I belong."
Some people, however, like to think of their company or team is a group of people, so may write:
"Our team, who are involved in customer service, will attend to your every need."
This is incorrect! A 'team' is a unit - a singular thing - so the verb in the relative clause, being in the plural, is wrong. This error is somewhat disguised by the fact that 'will attend' may be singular or plural. If one were to write the sentence in the present tense (either "... are ready to attend to your every need" or "... is ready ...") it is easier to see how muddled thinking has contributed to the error.
If one wants to stress the fact that the team (or company) is composed of real people, then one would have to rewrite the relative clause like this:
"Our team, the members of which are involved in customer service, is ready to/will attend to your every need."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
There are a number of other errors in the passage you quote besides the incorrect case of the relative pronoun.
- 'People ... that are passionate about their business' should be 'People ... who are passionate about their business' but this would make the adjectival clause 'whom we meet' sound decidedly awkward.
- One should not start a sentence with a conjunction. The full stop before "But ..." is incorrect. (The exception to this is when 'however' is used as the conjuction). In any case, why use 'but' here? Surely, people who are 'passionate about their business' should be expected to also 'crave growth'. 'And' would be more logical as the conjunction here (and 'they' then becomes redundant)
- There is a redundant 'is' after 'Success' in the fourth sentence.
- The definite article before 'creative work' is incorrect (a common error). The writer is talking of a generality (and using 'creative work' as a collective noun), not any specific creative work, so NO article should be used.
In better, plainer English, it might be:
"Our organization has over ["more than" might be better] a decade of experience in marketing. We love meeting people who are passionate about their business and crave growth. Success with us is practically inevitable. Our team shares passion. Being an integrated marketing agency, we have the ability to execute creative work in many ways."
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@owlwings (43897)
• Cambridge, England
25 Feb 13
On reflection, I can see that the word order of the adjectival relative clause "whom we meet" can be slightly confusing if you are used to sentences where the subject comes first. If you analyse what action is going on in the clause, however, you will see that the action is "meeting", the people who are doing the meeting are "we" and the people to whom the action is being done are the "whom" ... referring to the people met.
As you can see, the whole thing gets excessively complex and should be written in more direct sentences.
@owlwings (43897)
• Cambridge, England
25 Feb 13
Perhaps another rendering of the passage, which attempts to retain the 'pithy' directness of the style, might be:
"[i]Our organization has more than a decade of experience in marketing.
We love meeting people who are passionate about their business and crave growth.
Success with us is almost inevitable: our team shares passion.
We are an integrated marketing agency, so we have the ability to execute creative work in many ways.[/i]"
Notice how I have used a colon to connect the two ideas of "success with us" and the "sharing of passion". Written out in full, this might be expressed as "Success with us is almost inevitable because we share your passion." but the 'shorthand' version, perhaps, fits better with this particular style.
@Manasha (2933)
• Pondicherry, India
25 Feb 13
sir
Is it fine to say crave growth or craving for growth?

@urbandekay (18278)
•
25 Feb 13
Our organization has over a decade of experience in marketing. We love people that we meet who are passionate about their business but crave growth. Success with us is almost inevitable.
Our team has a shared passion and, being an integrated marketing agency, we have the ability to execute the creative work in many ways.
Note, whom or whomever are used for the object of a sentence, who or whoever when referring to the subject.
You cannot say 'practically inevitable' since it implies the only chance of failure is theoretical and that is untrue, what you mean is 'almost.'
I have also joined some of your sentences together with conjunctions that render it less stilted and more readable.
all the best, urban
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@owlwings (43897)
• Cambridge, England
25 Feb 13
I agree with you about 'practically'. I missed that one!
.
'the creative work' should be 'creative work' because no specific or single instance of 'creative work' is intended.
The multiple relative pronouns in the second sentence are a problem. I believe that my solution (below) reads rather better. (And also see my reasoning regarding the use of 'and' rather than 'but' - 'but' usually implies an exception or an exclusion. If you were to draw a Venn diagram of "people who are passionate about their business" and "people who crave growth [of their business]" as two overlapping circles, 'BUT' would tend to indicate only the overlapping part (actually, a logical 'AND'), whereas a semantic 'AND' includes all of both circles. It is to be hoped, anyway, that ALL people who are passionate about their business also crave growth, so the diagram ought to be two concentric circles, ideally of an equal diameter! However, we digress!)
.
'the creative work' should be 'creative work' because no specific or single instance of 'creative work' is intended.
The multiple relative pronouns in the second sentence are a problem. I believe that my solution (below) reads rather better. (And also see my reasoning regarding the use of 'and' rather than 'but' - 'but' usually implies an exception or an exclusion. If you were to draw a Venn diagram of "people who are passionate about their business" and "people who crave growth [of their business]" as two overlapping circles, 'BUT' would tend to indicate only the overlapping part (actually, a logical 'AND'), whereas a semantic 'AND' includes all of both circles. It is to be hoped, anyway, that ALL people who are passionate about their business also crave growth, so the diagram ought to be two concentric circles, ideally of an equal diameter! However, we digress!) @kalav56 (11464)
• India
7 Mar 13
“Our organization has over a decade of experience in marketing. We love people who we meet that are passionate about their business. But they crave growth. Success is with us is practically inevitable.
Our team shares passion. Being an integrated marketing agency, we have the ability to execute the creative work in many ways.
I am unhappy with the sentence because I feel it is slightly clumsy. I shall come to it later.
Regarding the query about ‘whom’ and ‘whom’ I shall suggest one easy way to get the right usage without thinking about whether it is in the nominative or accusative case.
Take two examples
Example 1] “I love my sister who spoke to you yesterday”.
Now split it—“I love my sister .She spoke to you yesterday... “The word “she’ denotes the sister here and is the subject of the second sentence.
Who spoke to you? Sister spoke to you------Got it?
‘She’ is the subject.
While combining it write it as “I love my sister who spoke to you yesterday”
Example 2]
I love my sister whom you met yesterday.
Split it
I love my sister .You met her yesterday.
You met someone. Whom did you meet?
You met ‘sister’.
You met her—Got it?
In the second sentence ’her ‘is the object.
While combining it write it as “I love my sister whom you met yesterday.
Relative pronoun used instead of a ‘subject’ –who
Relative pronoun used instead of the ‘object’.-whom.
Coming to the sentence given
“We love people who we meet that are passionate about their business.”—Think about it with the example given above.
I shall continue later; I have some work to do. But I shall get back.
@DoctorDidi (7018)
• India
25 Feb 13
The corrected form of the sentence would be as follows-'Our organization has over a decade of experience in marketing. We love people whom we meet and are passionate about their business. But they crave growth. Success with us is practically inevitable.
Our team shares passion. Being an integrated marketing agency, we have the ability to execute the creative work in many ways.'
@roshigo58 (4856)
• Pune, India
8 Mar 13
Hi,
You have got the answer to your question from many mylot friends. All your discussions are based on English and grammar. I don't give any response to your discussion but your discussion adds my knowledge of English.
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