An Atheistic Bible Study Of The Gospels The Transfiguration.
@arthurchappell (44941)
Preston, England
August 25, 2018 4:21pm CST
Three of the four Gospels cover this event, which goes beyond all ambiguity regarding the question of Whether Jesus is human, a prophet or claiming to be the Son of God.
Matthew 17:1-13
Six days after previously described events, Jesus, accompanied by three Apostles, Peter, James & John, head up a high mountain.
Jesus is suddenly transfigured. He becomes a bright shining light, as do his clothes. As this happens, the Old Testament Jewish prophets Moses and Elijah turn up and talk with Jesus.
The Apostles are expected to observe and not join in the discussion, but Peter interrupts to ask Jesus if it alright if he and the other two Apostles build little tabernacle prayer stacks, one for each of the great prophets and Jesus.
Jesus offers no answer and the visiting ghosts of the prophets do not even acknowledge that the men exist, but a bright cloud arrives over the mountain top and a voice booms out that Jesus is its Son, and that the cloud (God) is happy with his work on Earth, and commands the Apostles to obey Jesus.
The Apostles fall to the floor in terror on hearing the voice of God. Jesus comes to them to tell them not to be afraid. As the Apostles get up they see that only Jesus is with them, not the cloud or Moses or Elijah.
As they descend from the mountain, Jesus tells the Apostles never to mention the incident to anyone until after he, Jesus, returns from the dead. Confused by the details the Apostles point out that before the Son Of God (a rather literal and extreme take on the Messiah concept) comes, the prophet Elijah is expected, due to prophesies, to return to prepare the masses.
Jesus replies that Elijah has returned only to suffer terribly in his efforts to prepare the way for Jesus, and that Jesus will also suffer and die soon. The Apostles realise that Jesus is talking of John The Baptist as a reincarnation of Elijah.
Mark 9:2-13
This version is very similar though Peter calls Jesus Rabbi rather than Lord. The
Apostles ask Jesus what he means about rising from the dead, but Jesus does not answer the question. Mark does not spell out that John The Baptist is Elijah as Matthew adds.
Luke 9:28-36
The differences from the other versions are slight. Luke says eight days passed since the last material he covered, two days more than Matthew & Mark. Luke points out that the discussion between the three prophets concerns plans for Jesus’s pending death and resurrection.
The Apostles are briefly put to heavy sleep during some of the discussion, again a detail omitted in the other accounts.
Luke’s version ends abruptly as the cloud evaporates, and assures us that the human witnesses told no one what they saw during the pre-Crucifixion period.
There is a lot to unpick in this sequence of events.
1/. Why does Jesus only take three of the twelve Apostles up the mountain?
2/. In not telling anyone what they saw, does that include not telling the other nine Apostles?
3/. The arrival of the other prophets in ghost-vision form I clearly to spell out that Jesus is a very important figure.
4/. We see no effort by the Old Testament figures to talk to the mortals, and God the cloud effectively points out that Jesus is the important one, outranking his predecessors.
5/. If John The Baptist is Elijah, why do none of the Apostles recognize him unless he is reincarnated into another body, but still coming as a ghost of his earlier form.
6/. Jesus seems to be planning his crucifixion and return to life after dying, but why does he need Moses and Elijah in this? None of the crucifixion events involve them.
7/. Jesus talks freely of his looming death and return, but only in Luke are the Apostles confused and troubled by this though Jesus avoids their questions.
8/. The Apostles going to sleep seems to serve no purpose and it is never explained.
An event that is written in after the crucifixion masquerading as a prophesy of it, and rendering the great Jewish prophets obsolete for the new Christian order.
Arthur Chappell
4 people like this
4 responses
@acelawrites (19272)
• Philippines
26 Aug 18
I am confused! Why were there so many versions? Who is in the transfiguration, isn't it Jesus Christ?
1 person likes this
@arthurchappell (44941)
• Preston, England
27 Aug 18
@acelawrites Transfiguration means change of appearance through spiritual means, Jesus is here revealed in his full divine nature rather than just as a man with delusions of grandeur. THe presence of Elijah & Moses just further backs up the story but it is still just that, a story
@Starmaiden (9308)
• Canada
26 Aug 18
1) Perhaps the three apostles Jesus took with Him to the mountain were the three most spiritually advanced of the 12, and were therefore "ready" to receive this lesson from Jesus.
2) Absolutely. The others were not spiritually ready to receive that information until they witnessed the resurrection of the Christ.
3) How does the arrival of the two other prophets in their spiritual bodies "spell out" the importance of Jesus?
4) Perhaps Jesus outranks his predecessors not because He is more powerful or holds more favor with God, but because of His timing. He was the last prophet to arrive before the End Times. He arrived at the beginning of the Piscean Age, 2000 years before the turning of the cosmic wheel, which begins another 26,000 year evolutionary period for humanity, with the ushering in of the Golden Age of Aquarius. He came to pave a way, through His own life example, for every human to follow. At the time of His arrival, the world needed someone who could "hold the light" in such a dark time in human history.
Perhaps the Age of Aquarius means the end of suffering and the "Ascension" of all who follow the example. (This doesn't mean christians, btw. If they continue to think that they have a "scapegoat" through Jesus, they are disillusioned.)
5) The Prophet Elijah would not sgow up in His John the Baptist spiritual form, unless He was to present Himself to Jesus as John the Baptist. The Apostles wouldn't recognise Elijah as John the Baptist. They were "told" that the Two are One and the same.
6) Perhaps Elijah and Moses were the Spirit Guides of Jesus and He wished to commune with them both before the "Big Event". (John the Baptist, aka Elijah, was conceived in the same manner as Jesus, although not to a supposed virgin. His mother was Mary's cousin Elizabeth. John the Baptist and Jesus were second cousins. Perhaps the reason Jesus' Spiritual Guide was born in the same lifetime as Jesus was for the sole purpose of "Baptising" Him and giving Him blessing. John the Baptist's life ended tragically shortly afterward.)
7)
Perhaps Luke was not one of three who accompanied Jesus to the mountain. Perhaps the third apostle was Judas Iscariot, who ended his life shortly after Jesus' arrest. Therefore, NO ONE got to hear or read his version and Luke only reiterated what he was "told" by the other two, which probably wasn't in all of its detail.
8) If the apostles were put into a "spiritual trance" during some of the conversation, perhaps it was because they were not meant to hear it, and upon awakening, would have no recollection of being asleep. How Luke would know this is the mystery.
4) Perhaps Jesus outranks his predecessors not because He is more powerful or holds more favor with God, but because of His timing. He was the last prophet to arrive before the End Times. He arrived at the beginning of the Piscean Age, 2000 years before the turning of the cosmic wheel, which begins another 26,000 year evolutionary period for humanity, with the ushering in of the Golden Age of Aquarius. He came to pave a way, through His own life example, for every human to follow. At the time of His arrival, the world needed someone who could "hold the light" in such a dark time in human history.
Perhaps the Age of Aquarius means the end of suffering and the "Ascension" of all who follow the example. (This doesn't mean christians, btw. If they continue to think that they have a "scapegoat" through Jesus, they are disillusioned.)
5) The Prophet Elijah would not sgow up in His John the Baptist spiritual form, unless He was to present Himself to Jesus as John the Baptist. The Apostles wouldn't recognise Elijah as John the Baptist. They were "told" that the Two are One and the same.
6) Perhaps Elijah and Moses were the Spirit Guides of Jesus and He wished to commune with them both before the "Big Event". (John the Baptist, aka Elijah, was conceived in the same manner as Jesus, although not to a supposed virgin. His mother was Mary's cousin Elizabeth. John the Baptist and Jesus were second cousins. Perhaps the reason Jesus' Spiritual Guide was born in the same lifetime as Jesus was for the sole purpose of "Baptising" Him and giving Him blessing. John the Baptist's life ended tragically shortly afterward.)
7)
Perhaps Luke was not one of three who accompanied Jesus to the mountain. Perhaps the third apostle was Judas Iscariot, who ended his life shortly after Jesus' arrest. Therefore, NO ONE got to hear or read his version and Luke only reiterated what he was "told" by the other two, which probably wasn't in all of its detail.
8) If the apostles were put into a "spiritual trance" during some of the conversation, perhaps it was because they were not meant to hear it, and upon awakening, would have no recollection of being asleep. How Luke would know this is the mystery.
1 person likes this
@arthurchappell (44941)
• Preston, England
27 Aug 18
Apart from possibly Judas any of the Apostles should have qualified as worthy of the chance to see the transfiguration. Over 2,000 years on and till no end times. The followers of Islam question Jeus as a true messiah as much as atheists do. Why would the son of God need spirit guides at all? Luke wa not a witnes. Those named are Peter, James and John. Yes, Luke writes of events he should not have any knowledge of.
1 person likes this
@crossbones27 (52905)
• Mojave, California
25 Aug 18
My question might make you mad? Is this to make people not believe? I think its neat how you tell it, but think a fair point to know why you write these.
