To Obey Or Not To Obey? (Wedding Vows)

Someone once told me that women were made to submit because after Eve ate the apple, her punishment would be that Adam would rule over her and that she'd desire him to do so.

But if Jesus died so that our sins would be forgiven, why is that even necessary? Paul wrote Eph 5:22 before Jesus died.

My Sweetheart and I protect and love eachother. I will never obey or submit in my vows or in my marriage, and he respects that. I will never expect him to do likewose, or to lead, we will walk together. He respects that too. We respect eachother.

HE is the one who insisted that if we ever get married I keep my last name. Of course!! I wouldn't change it even if he thought I had to. I'm so happy he and I can agree to all that, and that he came up with it before I even had to bring it up. I am really lucky.

Even though it's not "possible" for anyone to obey in this society and in the present age, why do you think a wife SHOULD obey?

yup wife should obey!!!! and so does the husband.... this is how the relation works give and take!!!! as it is said in my religon... god has said,"if i would ask anyone to bow in front of i would ask wives to bow in front of their husbands"

Where does it say that? Which religion? And if both should obey, why should the wife be MORE obedient?

islam... muslim religon!!! women should obey husband and husband should respect their wife!!! god has created all man equal as teeth of a comb... there are no races no tribes and no caste. it is man who has divided themself! now you will ask me if he has created everyone equally then why women should obey more??? each has different duties... if both man and a women preform same duties everything will go craze... so womens are suppose to obey their husbands and husbands are suppose to fulfill their duty!!! everything works systematically!!

Thank you for giving us your view. I can see where that would work in theory, but I am not better at something simply because of my gender. I am not extremely good with children. I don't even really like children! OK I like children like my nieces and nephews, to play with them and have fun, but I am not a "mother" type person, nor would I make a good teacher. Does that make me less of a woman? No! Do I have other talents? Many! I may not be good with children, for example, but I have written many wonderful children's stories, because that's one thing I CAN do and something I feel comfortable doing. I have that way that I can reach children, instead of being a "mother" to them.

If respect was guarenteed, I don't think anyone would have to obey anyone!! I think Mssnow said it best, with her comment about not needing obedience. and then there is her article, which I linked, in one of my comments on her response.

under islam a woman must obey the man due to the fact that she is less value than a man for instance in court it takes two women to equal the word of one man!

I would like to tell every 1 here is Quran say" god created men and women different but equal". Addin to that they both have different reponsiblities to fullfill. On failing to fullfill the reponsibilties they will be caught hold on the DAY OF JUDGEMENT. There is reason for everything and ISLAM provide answer for all. Religions are not based on your or my logic!! Regarding the word of 2women=1man there is a reason! since you have posted the question i know you will know the answer tooo so plzz paste that also. I would also like to say since religion has come in between that its been foretold in the BIBLE the coming of another prophet kindly refer the scriptures which states "I shall raise the prophet among thy bretheron for he shall guide yee into all truth, for he shall not speak of his own what he shall hear that shall he speak". I guess this is enough to answer all your issue about religion! you all know who the prophet is and the words of god is the holy QURAN. Religion is from GOD and dont make judgement on what he has said as HE KNOWS WHAT YOU DONOT.

I agree with you about times changing. When you get married, will you take his last name? If the answer is yes, then how can your partnership (or anyone else's) be equal if the woman changes her name and the man does not? How can one tradition be acceptable but not another one? If a bride is going to take her husband's name, shouldn't she just give up and vow to obey? Isn't that the same thing?

I see what you're getting at with the name change with a woman taking her husbands last name, but I prefer to see it as a sign of the partnership, not as a form of obeying her husband.

I understand how the same last name symbolizes partnership, but why is it usually the woman who changes? Why doesn't he become Mr. Your name?

I am married, and I do not take my husband's last name.

Good for you, I owuldn't do it either!

Not in any way shape or form would I obey or agree to obey my husband. It was included in our wedding (after a specific request for it to not be there) and when repeating the vows I changed it to "honor". Dogs obey. Wives listen, comfort, and keep everything running smoothly.

I'm glad you did what was right for you. Did the preacher do anything when you changed it? What happened?

Good for you for changing it, when you requested it be omitted in the first place. What did the preacher do when you refused to obey? Did anything happen?

Having been emotionally abused as a child, and my mother was emotionally abused by my father, I could never do that. No way!!!!! I believe everything happens for a reason and that Dad's abuse was a sign from God that if we give up our own minds, this is what is going to happen to our families. Women, wake up and pay attention!!! Love and respect your husband, but don't let him lead you around by the nose ring!!

I was emotionally, physically, and sexually abused as a child. However, I am allowing God to heal all of that and use it for his glory. The Bible says, What the devil means for evil, God will turn around for good, so that he may be glorified. Read the word and see what it says.

Stop telling God about your problems, and start telling your problems about your God.

I hear what you are saying, and I do not agree with it. I believe there are many different interpretations of the same word. If I were to tell my husband "Jeg Elsker Dig" you may not know what that means (unless you understand Danish!) but he knows when I tell him that it means 'I love you' Same meaning, different words/language.

I crave knowledge. Would you please explain your understanding of these things in the Bible. I want to know the right way to do things so that my marriage wil be as successful as possible.

rosie a christian woman should love her husband and submit to him to submit is not always followed by the rest of that verse that the man is to love his wife as Christ loves the church .meaning the husband would be willing to give his life for her just as Jesus did for the church .how many men would do this in reality??????

I was saved when I was a little girl. It didn't mean very much to me then, I just wanted to be like everyone else around me. My mother was a minister, she died when I ten. I spent the first ten years going to church and learning about the Lord.
There comes a time though, when you have to get to know the Lord for yourself, as an adult. I did not do this until I was 26 years old. This was the point that I started to doubt. I realized that I could no longer go by what I had learned as a child.
So I set out to study the word and get to know God for myself. I just loved/ love studying the word of God. In 1997, I had my own apartment for a year, I needed to experience it. During this year, I spent most of my time alone and I read the bible all the way through in six months.
I was trying to remember eveything that it said, I just wanted to know what it did not say. I knew it would take a lifetime to really know the Bible like I wanted to, but I wanted to get an idea of who he was. Last year, made ten years that I have been walking with him.
There are two things that I now know for certain about God. He is real and his word is true. You can't go by what anyone else says though, you have got to get to know him for yourself.

Revdauphinee, No where in the Bible does it say that a woman is to love her husband. I know it sounds good, but that is not what the Bible says and there is a reason for that. And is has to do with this very subject.
If a man is to be over his wife, then he needs to love her. If a woman is to submit to her husband, then she needs to respect him.
In reality, you don't know whether or not a God fearing man would lay down his life for his wife or not. You are judging by the men you know or have known. Believe me when I tell you, all men are not the same.

Thank you Mssnow. Thank you for responding to this discussion, I hoped you would, especially after I saw your earlier discussion with a unique slant on the same topic. MyLot, please click on this link to see another awsome discussion on obedience and marriage.

http://www.mylot.com/w/discussions/855642.aspx

Your comment is greatly appreciated, and I totally agree with you.

sometimes the word obedient is misused and misunderstood already. that we obey those people who are of superiority to us. wives obey their husbands because they are superior since they are men. that was long time ago. and mssnow is right. it's always better to have mutual agreements and respect for each other.

Yup!! No one's superior to me, and I'm superior to no one. Just because someone has a bit more experience, and gender has nothing to do with that, doesn't make them better.

yep. especially in marriage, noone should be superior. that is why we are bonded as one during the vows, right? it's because we think together, decide together and go on with life together. no need for someone to be superior than the other.

Amen!

Amen to that!!! Sadly though, Respect has been turned into an authoritative word, and is often the honey-coated version of obey. I like YOUR definition of respect better. Mutual respect, earned respect. If I am going to marry the man it means we have already earned eachother's respect, we are merely vowing to continue to respect eachother. We both have our own heads, and neither of us has an ego big enough to need to be the one in charge, with the final say. Well put!

thanks for the appreciation. it's just that i have known lots of friends who are into "obeying" their husbands. and when asked why... they always say because they are scared not to follow their partners... scared to be beaten up or be scolded upon. so, for me, as i've heard from their stories, it's not much a perspective to me anymore.

my boyfriend and i talked about it. and we are more into the mutual respect than the thought of just obeying for the sake of making someone happy.

If you're scared of a person then you are not meant to be with that person. That's what these people need to realize! Thanks for sharing.

Very well said!!!!!! Sorry you are divorced, but I know in my heart your not obeying him had NOTHING to do with that. Thank you for commenting.

Thanks....i'm free not sorry for me....BYE

To be "my?" I think I would have answered "he is not my anything, I do not own him, but if you're asking me if I'll love him forever as the individual that he is, then I promise to do exactly that."

I did not want to repeat the whole thing...it goes on to say my lawfully wedded husband to honor and cherish through sickness and health and so on.

It's nice to see a familliar face (literally!!) replying to this thread. I love your comments and postings on Gather, too.

The traditional flow of the vows and most of the wording is nice, but a few things like "obey," "submit" and "Mr, and Mrs. John Smith (...)" for example are extremely outdated, in my opinion.

OH yes, "man and wife" is another thing I'd also leave out. How about "woman and husband?" LOL

Thanks again for your comment.

I think that example is a little extreme, but I do see what you are trying to say. I am glad that if you chose to keep the word in there you BOTH vowed it.

I would leave out "obey and submit" and gender roles, and my sweetie and I would keep our names, and we'd write our own vows too, but that's up to us. If your way worked for you, then that is good for you. Thank you for sharing your story and your opinion.

I would say if one wants it in the vows then they should also be will say they will do the same. Submit I woudl nto ask that of future Mrs or would i give it to them for each should have enough respect for each other there would be no need to submission but respect for each others choices and wishes.

Right on!

These vow might jsut work for me next time i decide to get hitched (Stolden from a web sight )



Pastor: Will you take her as your wife? Will you love her all your life?

Groom: Yes, I take her as my wife, Yes, I'll love her all my life.

Pastor: Will you have, and also hold Just as you have at this time told?

Groom: Yes, I will have, and I will hold, Just as I have at this time told, Yes, I will love her all my life As I now take her as my wife.

Pastor: Will you love through good and bad? Whether you're happy or sad?

Groom: Yes, I'll love through good and bad, Whether we're happy or sad, Yes, I will have and I will hold Just as I have already told, Yes, I will love her all my life, Yes, I will take her as my wife!

Pastor: Will you love her if you're rich? Or if you're poor, and in a ditch?

Groom: Yes, I'll love her if we're rich, And I will love her in a ditch, I'll love her through good times and bad, Whether we are happy or sad, Yes, I will have, and I will hold (I could have sworn this has been told!) I promise to love all my life This woman, as my lawful wife!

Pastor: Will you love her when you're fit, And also when you're feeling sick?

Groom: Yes, I'll love her when we're fit, And when we're hurt, and when we're sick, And I will love her when we're rich And I will love her in a ditch
And I will love through good and bad, And I will love when glad or sad, And I will have, and I will hold Ten years from now a thousandfold, Yes, I will love for my whole life This lovely woman as my wife!

Pastor: Will you love with all your heart? Will you love till death you part?

Groom: Yes, I'll love with all my heart From now until death do us part, And I will love her when we're rich, And when we're broke and in a ditch, And when we're fit, and when we're sick, (Oh, CAN'T we get this finished quick?) And I will love through good and bad, And I will love when glad or sad, And I will have, and I will hold, And if I might now be so bold, I'll love her my entire life, Yes, I WILL take her as my wife!

Pastor: Then if you'll take her as your wife, And if you'll love her all your life, And if you'll have, and if you'll hold, From now until the stars grow cold,
And if you'll love through good and bad, And whether you're happy or sad, And love in sickness, and in health, And when you're poor, and when in wealth, And if you'll love with all your heart, From now until death do you part, Yes, if you'll love her through and through, Please answer with these words:

Pastor and Groom: I DO!

Pastor: You're married now! So kiss the bride,
But please, do keep it dignified.