Difference between Calvinsim and Arminianism

@suspenseful (40192)
Canada
December 13, 2007 2:33pm CST
It seems that many people seem to thing that rather than God chosing us, that we ought to choose God. As I am a Calvinist, I would like to explain the difference. Calvinists believe that even the most innocent infant is tainted with original sin. That does not mean that such infant will grow up to be a type of John Gacey, but that the potential is there. Arminianism belief is that an infant is born innocent, and only develops a sinful nature by his or her upbringing or enviroment. So if such infant is brought up in a high crime district and is abused by his or her parents, such infant is more than likely to develop into a criminal. In my mind, believing that you were born in sin makes it easier for us to believe in pro-life, etc. because who in us is to decide what baby should not be allowed to live because we do not know whom God has destined to Eternal life. Oh and those not chosen for Eternal life, there is a verse that they shall be punished with few stripes, while those who know and deliberately go against God's will will be punished by many stripes. Also sometimes God will call someone into HIS kingdom if such a person prays really hard, but usually that means that God has already chosen him, since he would not have asked otherwise. There are more evangelists who are Armianian, Billy Graham, and Jerry Falwell, for instance. Calvinists believe in infant baptism which is considered the sign of the covenant and their parents are supposed to raise them in the Lord, that is read the Bible to them, read Bible stories, and teach them the Ten Commandments as far as they will understand. When the child grows to be eighteen or older, the young man or lady will make the profession of faith, so that he or she can receive the Lord's Supper. This makes him or her a mature Christian. During this period of time, the young person may have troubles with various sins or wrongdoings, but must not continue and ask for God's forgiveness to overcome them. A non=Christian cannot understand it, because once you get angry at a small thing, smoke a lot, or go to the movies to see movies with lots of s*xual content or movies that are inappropriate for your age, you will always do these things and if you do not, there is something wrong with you. You cannot be baptised each time or make a profession of faith each time you fall. An Arminian, which includes Baptists, Methodists, etc. is baptised as an adult, and only after he or she lives an exemplerary life. And if he or she does not, then she or he is more likely to join another church and be rebaptised. Calvinists become children of God by grace, and do works of mercy in thankful to God and gives God credit. He or she does not sit on his or her laurels. However he or she is given gifts by God, and so it is more than likely that this gift will be utilized. Arminians think that by works they can earn salvation. Roman Catholics do the same, but I do not know that much except that when you go to Mass you do a lot of responsive singing, alleluias, etc. after the Father speaks and most of what I learned was by watching Bing Crosby in Going My Way and the Trouble with Angels. Now since Calvinists are baptised as infants, and not considered to be oh or perfect, they are fighting against sin and also there is no set rule such as "no television, wear dresses and skirts calf length, have a dour look on your face,etc. They live a Christian life but not a legalistic life, therefore other than no committing adultury, fornification, gambling, and working on Sundays, unless works of necessity and mercy, reading the Bible, praying, etc. contrasts with the Arminian view that you cannot watch this or that, you cannot drink anyh Alcohol, etc. and you have to look like a Christian, as plain as possible, etc. The rule of Calvinists is moderation in all things. An example is drinking but not to excess. It does not mean that Calvinists have trouble and everything is easy, many of us have to fight against watching bad shows on TV, some of us can watch bad shows and not be affected, while others cannot and the rule is if someone comes to your house and will be hurt by watching, lets say for example, "S*x in the City" (I do not watch this show,) because the houseowner just loves New York. then the houseowner will not watch that episode of "S*x in the City" while the weak believer is present. I have included a link that might help. It also explains the difference between Calvinism and Hyper-Calvinism since I am unsure about those myelf. Welcome any comments in a nice manner as possible and without flaming. http://www.biblehelp.org/whatsel.htm
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4 responses
@ElicBxn (64172)
• United States
13 Dec 07
I disagree on some parts of what you have said - for one thing the Calvinists got Original Sin from the Catholics. Many of the Arminians encourage their young people to "profess" God in their early teens. They don't have to be blameless before - just try to be after. You are right, about them being re-Baptizes, not taking that Sacrament as seriously as other faiths. I have belonged to several different religions. I was brought up Presbyterian, went to a Baptist Church for several years and ended up in a Western Rite Orthodox church. I found the only one that believed the Bible about "by their fruits (works) you shall know them" was the Orthodox faith. You can count the Roman Church in that - tho just as with any other church there are people that attend but don't act like it except when they are in church. I left the protestant faiths because I found too many would "talk the talk" but fail to "walk the walk."
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@GardenGerty (169543)
• United States
14 Dec 07
Unfortunately that is everywhere, isn't it?
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@suspenseful (40192)
• Canada
14 Dec 07
The Catholic Church was the true Church until it went from the original practice into selling indulgences, worshiping Mary and the Saints, believing in purgatory, etc. All the Reformed and Presbyterian churches did was to go back to the original Catholic church. So in essence, the Roman Catholic church failed to be the true church. Most of them worship Mary above Jesus. The one my daughter-in-law does not, so it is getting back to what the true Catholic Church does, but it is not yet. The Arminian church I attended you had to be at least eighteen. If you go to my profile, you can see my blog and a link to my church. You can read the Heidleberg Catechism, the Belgic Confession, and the confession of Dort that will explain the difference. Sorry I did not attend theology college so I do not have a bunch of doctorates behind me.
@suspenseful (40192)
• Canada
15 Dec 07
Is that the Orthodox Presbyterian Church or do you mean the Greek or Russian Orthodox Church? I know about the former. In fact our church is in ecclestical fellowship with them. I heard that the Greek or Russian Orthodox church does not believe in the Trinity Is that true? As for the Virgin Mary who was no longer after she gave birth to Jesus's first half brother (or) Sister. She was a good woman, or God would not have chosen her to bear the Christ Child, but she is not to be worshiped. The Catholic Church my daughter-in-law goes to does not worship Mary, they worship God. Since most of the people there were of French and German descent, it comes from that inheritance. I think it is what is called a Chariasmatic Catholic Church. So please do not scold me for my ignorance. I did study about the original Catholic Church and had there not been those things wrong with it, such as going away from the faith, all of us Christians would still be Catholics. You probably attended Evangical or Arminian Protestant churches like Pentacostal, the Foursquare Gospels, Anglican, Lutheran, Methodist, Weslyian, etc. I used to be a United Churcher and a Pentacostal. I could never measure up amd the latter was trying to bring the world into the service to get more members, and all that shouting and writhing, and speaking gooblygook and saying they were speaking in tongues, not to mention lack of forgiveness for those who gave up a disasterous habit and treating them as if they still had it, drove me from them. Now I belong to a Calvinist church is like the old Catholic church and it does call its doctrine, Catholic.
@artemis432 (7474)
• Abernathy, Texas
14 Dec 07
I'll read all of your links on this thread when I can. Its so confusing - why are only some chosen and not others?
@suspenseful (40192)
• Canada
14 Dec 07
Here is a link to the Belgic Confession: the Canons of Dort,and the Heidelberg Confession. I did not write the Bible and I did not make this up. http://www.reformed.org/documents/BelgicConfession.html http://www.reformed.org/documents/synod_of_dort.html http://www.prca.org/hc_index.html The above will explain who is chosen, and who is not. There are also Bible references. I found it hard to understand myself. All I know is if you decide to follow the Bible and then start to attend a Bible believing church, and you have something in your heart a confidence that you will go to heaven, you are chosen. The funny thing is that you also think you do not deserve it that there are better people than you.
• Abernathy, Texas
14 Dec 07
RAther, I meant, I'll read all of your links on this thread and the other religious thread I was participatng in. Sorry about that. I forgot to add the remainder of the sentence.
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• Abernathy, Texas
14 Dec 07
So does your belief that you will go to heaven have to be greater then your belief that you won't - or you won't go?
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@GardenGerty (169543)
• United States
14 Dec 07
I do not want to tread on toes, but Baptists are Calvinists where I come from, and I am from a Wesleyan Arminian belief. I was baptized as a child, and had the kind of upbringing in the faith that you describe. There are lots of differences even within those theological categories that you have given. For instance, I was raised on the verse, " For by grace you have been saved, not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not of works lest any man should boast." Ephesian 2:8-9 As I have studied the Bible and religion, and people, it seems that when you scrape all of the semantics away, we are pretty much the same. I believe that Satan loves it if we spend our time disagreeing with our Christian brothers and sisters, because then we are not busy doing what God has sent us to do.
@GardenGerty (169543)
• United States
14 Dec 07
And for the record, I am not Mennonite, Amish, Brethern, Mennonite Brethern or any of those categories.
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@GardenGerty (169543)
• United States
15 Dec 07
Hi, I am glad this is not going to turn into a big fight. I do not have a lot of doctorates, but I do have an Associate in Religion (two years) and a daughter and son in law who both have ministerial degrees. I also like many of the things that you say about what YOU believe, and your church as well. Some of those denominations do not even exist where I live. In my part of the United States we have many types of Baptists, and some of them do have lots of do's and don'ts. Some of them try to tell you who you will vote for if you are truly saved. All of those things get away from the fact that Jesus is the Lord. He is Lord of our life and is a personal Saviour. He is the final and ultimate Judge, not man.Methodists, American Methodist Episcopal, United Methodist, Free Methodists, and Wesleyan Methodists are some of the churches that are of the Wesleyan tradition. I believe Nazarene is as well. Yes, John Wesley was influenced by the Armenians on his trip to the New World as a missionary. But Methodists are not Armenians. So, is the Reformed Church the same as what we call Lutheran? I know that Presbyterian Doctrine is a Calvinist Doctrine. I think, personally, that God looks down at us and smiles at our small Human attempts to understand the Divine and to partake of His nature.
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@suspenseful (40192)
• Canada
15 Dec 07
Reformed is like Presbyterian. Only not the new Presbyterian who believes that homosexuality living is not a sin. From what I know, Reformed is mainly from the Dutch background, while Presbyterian are English. Thus we have the Heildelberg Catechism,etc while they have the Westminster Catechism, that are basically saying the same thing only in a different way. I think the Lutherans are like the German version of the Anglican church in that they have lots of rites that came from the Roman Catholic Church, but they do not believe in a Pope, but am not an expert on that.
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@kurtbiewald (2625)
• United States
13 Dec 07
whoa !!!!!!!!! Calvin got a comic with Hobbes Armenians have a cultural center in Watertown where they let chess tournamants happen. They had some kinda genocide I think I heard about. thats all I know
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@suspenseful (40192)
• Canada
13 Dec 07
Actually this is about two different viewpoints of the Christian religion, not about the comic book or about a country. And this isn not about the Armenians who were persecuted by the Turks, Armenia is a country, John Calvin is one of the founders of the Protestant Reformation. Arminiasm is the Christian belief that man choses God. One of the proponents was Menno Simon, founder of the Mennoniites. Calvinisim is the belief that God choses man.