This is Job Corp. Is this what you want for your child?

Hello Spalladino, It seems to me that what is being lost in this discussion is the pervasive reality of 'the slippery slope'. I recently responded to a discussion where I pointed out a most absurd example of the 'slippery slope' argument that is frequently applied by massive, slow, cumbersome governmental agencies. That example is: While the majority of Americans support responsible pet-ownership, the very liberal, self-described 'progressive' Albuquerque City Council saw fit, a few years back, to create a law that requires dog owners to purchase 'dog toys' for their pets. This mandatory law is in conjunction with other animal welfare provisions of the law, like providing adequate food, shelter, water and shelter. Though, it mandated the toy requirement to foster an environment where dogs are entertained. Moreover, the law includes a mandatory provision that one's dog must not be subjected to freezing temperatures. The result: many instances where one neighbor 'rats out' another neighbor for violating this ridiculous law. In one instance, a citizen had to take time off from work to attend a legal hearing, to defend against criminal charges that she neglected her beloved dog by leaving him out in the cold. Turns out, we had a severe snow storm, which closed the interstate, and the woman was forced to stay overnight, out of town. She was sick with worry about her dog, yet the law mandates that when the interstate is closed, one cannot travel upon it. Incidentally, in my state, there are a vast number on one-way-in, one-way-out communities, which means that if one can't access our main roads, they cannot get home. This quite typically happens whenever we get severe storms. What's more, a storm can roll in with little advanced notice, because of our airstream conditions. In the end, the woman did not have to pay the fine, which as I recall is $75 or $100. Though, she had to take time off from work to deal with the absurdity, and suffered the additional stress of having to appear for the hearing. There is a VERY GREAT DANGER in allowing government to manadate our lives. We are no longer FREE if we allow government to dicate our personal decisions!!! I believe the "right to choose" argument applies here. If a citizen has the right to choose to have an abortion, then shouldn't that same citizen have the right to choose who, and how parenting, or pet ownership should be undertaken????????? The irony of mandatory volunteerism is no less an oxymoron than is the right to choose, as it has been so hypocritcally applied!

I do not have children old enough to be eligible for Job Corp but I do not think my kids will be going to these "training centers" anytime soon. Actually let me rephrase that statment to never will I let them go into the job corp. I can help them receive all the training they well every need with out the government taking over my parental responsiblity.

The problems you mention with JOB CORPS are typical of all government run organizations. This results from the selection to management process always inevitably becoming politicized. As other respondents have pointed out, some JOB CORPS facilities are admirably run. What the people praising JOB CORPS don't realize is that there is a process of decay in the quality of management of all government run organizations. It just seems to always happen as a result of people trying to expand their empires. As someone of lesser ability finally manages to get above their level of competance, they are always sure to not promote talent as that would make them look bad. How do you maintain your empire if subordinates are more talented than you? As a result, JOB CORPS facilities such as you describe come into being. As a result of this same process of management decay, good JOB CORPS facilities are likely to not remain so. This is inherent in all government agencies. It is inherent that political skills become more important than management skills in most government undertakings. In private industry that can go broke and has a profit motive, the bad empire building only managers are much more likely to be weeded out. In government, these clowns are the boss and on the rise.

I am not a parent, but I have studied parenting and developmental psychology, and I am against the government trying to tell people how to raise their kids! I had a difficult time in high school because of other kids, so I ended up having to leave and do homeschooling, but I did go on to get my GED and graduate a year early! So I don't think that this Job Corps is necessary even for troubled 16 year olds. If kids are raised right, by their parents, they will know what they need to do. I knew I wanted to graduate high school, but I knew I couldn't go back and face the bullies and stuff, so I took GED classes at night and took the exam to get my diploma. I then went on to college, I never really thought about going, I just felt like it was an important thing, so I went. Now, I am a recent graduate, and I'm not 100% sure how I will get a job, but I do have career goals, and if I have to get a job to make money to support that career I do have a degree, and may even go back in the future to get a higher degree or technical degree. So from the way I see it, this program takes away people's decisions, it offers an allowance--but is the little bit of support going to make up for the freedom they probably take away? I doubt it. But some people from homes with a lot of kids, or that are very low income may see it as a way to help their families with money. And that is not a fair trade off from what I've heard about this program. I just believe that the parents should be left to raise their kids the best they can, and yes, if there is abuse or something, then there should be an intervention, but otherwise the government has no place in parenting someone else's kids!

Spalladino, I also worked in a PA one-stop for three years, and my boyfriend worked as youth counselor (ie the man making referrals to the Job Corps programs). You have been SEVERELY misinformed about Job Corps! The nature of government funded programs is that they must speak to people of ALL circumstances. Which means that perhaps you never would consider sending your grandkids to such a program, and perhaps you are right not to? A lot of the students in a Job Corps program have violent histories, and many are there after expulsion from ordinary or alternative school programs. No, I would not recommend a Job Corp program for a high school student with the bright possibility of college. However, there are teenagers and young adults who come from less advantaged households. High school and/or college do not exist as viable options for them. Funding to help these job seekers who hold no GED or valid job skill is highly unstable. For them, Job Corps may be an appropriate choice. That individual would meet with (most likely) a series of counselors to ensure that it IS the appropriate choice. Regardless of any negative press, Job Corps serves a very specific and real portion of the community. Whether you are part of that community or not is irregardless, it is not your place or anyone else's to say that portion of the community should not be served. And (for the record), enrollment into a JobCorp program is strictly voluntary. You never have to worry about the government coming into your home and taking your kids! :-)

Does anyone know jop corps rules and reg. b/c my fiance left last week for it and now im worried?!?!?! I have not heard from him in 6 days and that is just not like him. Can someone tell me a bit more of how life is for people who go there he is in shriver job corp. thanks

I know two young men that voluntarily joined this and were success stories. They learned job skills and are now very productive citizens. When they went in, they were on the borderline of joining a gang. So here is at least one good thing about it.

Are you sure that you are not talking about the boot camps for troubled kids. I have only heard about good things from Job Corp. A young man I used to work with had an older brother go there, he is now working as an Auto mechanic and he said the program was very good.

I am so glad I went through and read this whole discussion before I began to type, otherwise my reply would've made no sense. In defense of Obama, I believe that if the time was taken to do the research it would be clear that he is not attempting to coerce our youth into these programs, and has clarified his position several times since the speech you cite. What he is proposing is that our youth become involved in social service programs and in return they get help with tuition for college, or in the case of Job Corps they get vocational training, which is not only beneficial to them, but to the country in the long run. I know college kids that have done volunteer work, and not only do they have more compassion and understanding of the world around them, they end up with an experience that looks great on a resume. Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing the day where your volunteer work doesn't make your resume stand out, I think as a country we should all be involved..and become of nation of solidarity, instead of a nation of the haves and have nots.

Is this optional or obligatory? I mean does this take the place of high school or college? It it is mandatory then it would seem to be a curtailment on individual freedom, if it is not then there should be no worries for parents or their children.

Hi Sapalladino, WOW!! You have blown my mind lady! I work for the State Agency "One Stop Career Center" in NJ and have been there for the past 15+ years, first in aiding in training and now in Administration. As an office of employment and training we have many, many contracts with different agencies and schools. Job Corp is one of them and to date I haven't heard of any negativity related to Job Corp. Could it be a state thing? But since the Dept. of Labor is behind it, could it be international or rather world wide? Monday morning, as soon as I get a minute with my supervisor, I will ask about this. She is very down to earth and very professional and she oversees all in-coming contracts and rates them acceptable or not. She could have an impact. Something like this should not be locked away, people need to know these things for their children's benefit. Thanks Spalladino, will keep you informed. ~G~

Because of the confusion between "Job Corps" and "Green Job Corps" I've started a separate post to discuss "Green Job Corps" at www.mylot.com/w/discussions/1614565.espx If anybody is interested in discussing mandatory volunteerism, that would be a better forum.

I have first-hand experience working at two Job Centers and I was so shocked by what I saw at both, I started a blog called Job Corps Fraud... Please visit my website by googling the words "Job Corps Fraud".

YOU GUYS ARE F*CKING IDIOTS job corps is a great program having said that it depends on witch center as long as it is not a center in a ghetto area this is truly a great program and if you or a loved one does not meet the requirments then dont f*cking complain how people dump there kids there or your over privaleged brats will never go there because how bad it is!!!! it saves under privaleged kids from the street or worse. i went there in the late 90s i make 90k a year f*ckers. but i dont think anyone under the age of 18 should go there unless circumstances requires it. o and there is alot of supervision.

That wasn't my experience at all with Job Corps. I lived across the street from them in Clearfield, UT, and the police were NEVER there for any problems. They used the kids to monitor behaviors at various public activities (usually parties being held at the Union Pacific train depot in Ogden - they patrolled the parking lots, etc.) I personally know two kids who went there and they thrived there when they were failing in regular public schools. They do operate in a military fashion, but offer a wide variety of training options. The one kids was learning construction. The other, the oldest son of my best friend out there, found he loved cooking, so took culinary classes. Now he's in Iraq - has been in the Army for about 4 years now. He was able to graduate there and loved attending when he hated attending school in Salt Lake. When I was moving from Utah to Arizona and it was just me and my 70 yr old father trying to load everything, I called them and they sent two huge strapping young men over to help - they were great. No disrespect, no problems, no supervision. Dad bought pizza for all of us and we got everything done. I'd recommend it in a heartbeat. That's not to say there aren't some centers with problems. But, my experience with the Clearfield Job Corps is that it's a great program and may be the last chance some of these kids have to succeed. They don't usually place them where they're having problems, but they did out there. Also, the kids got to go off-base on weekends - if they lived locally, they could go home. If family came to see them, they could spend time with them on weekends. It's not a lockdown, prison camp like you have presented. Also, they gave all of us front row seats to fireworks on 4th of July (something that was long not celebrated when I first moved to Utah - they celebrate the 24th of July). I think you have it all wrong. I know you have it all wrong. I've seen it first hand and know graduates of the program.

My name is Heaven Benson and i am and graduate of Clearfield Job Corps in Clearfield, UT... i personally think that every student should have the opportunity to attend a job corps center. The experience and educational training that i have received there will take me places... I have made lifelong friends and good choices because of Job corps... so do not knock them, just cause you don't know all of the facts... Most of the teachers are wonderful and they are more then willing to help a student out. some of them will even stay until 9pm just to help students out, i should know, my teacher has for me... so do your research before you try saying anything bad about all job corps centers, cause not ALL of them are bad.

I worked for Dept of Labor for many years, when I first heard of this program I thought it was a great idea. Then I talked to many participants......this is not something that I would want for my children or anyone elses. I don't want to go into details but I think that there are a lot of "bad elements" in the program.

My son actually attended Job corp and it was a great experience. He was not forced to go. Job corp is purely optional. He went on and enlisted in the Navy right after he graduated from Job Corp so it was a great choice. And as far as the comments about PRESIDENT OBAMA! It is obvious that a comment he made has been taken completely out of context. The comment about him wanting to send 250,000 to Job corp....I see all of the negative comments.....Well I have never heard of anyone dying at job Corp....what about the Thousands of young men that Former President Bush have forced and have sent to be slaughtered in Iraq and other countries. It is obvious that everything PRESIDENT OBAMA does will be scrutinized under the microscope of prejudice. Wake up and give him a fair chance......He cant do to much more wrong that than Bush has......Look at the budget crisis that He left for PRESIDENT OBAMA to clean up. Back to the real subject.......Job Corp is a very good program especially for young people who may have had trouble in their traditional school. Also a positive for Job Corp is once they graduate, they actually get a check for approx $1,500.00 - (Maybe a little more or less) but it is at least $1,000.00- When my son graduated from there 3 years ago, he was able to use it to get a car.