Gay Panic
By grandpa_lash
@grandpa_lash (5225)
Australia
August 21, 2012 9:23pm CST
I found out this morning something that I had never heard of before, and which I doubt my imagination could ever have conceived.
Three states in Australia have a defence for murder called the "Gay Panic" defence. In effect, this says that a man who kills a gay man in panic at having been non-violently propositioned has justification. The defence doesn't always work, but it is on the books and has been upheld on occasion.
What a bunch of pathetic losers the politicians who passed this bill are. If a woman kills an abusive husband, or a rapist, she will go to jail except in very clear cases. But the gay panic defence has nothing to do with resisting a violent attempt at rape, it is used for a man who simply reacts violently and homicidally to a proposition from a gay man. The defence assumes that a man will quite rightly go psychotic at the horror of it.
I don't know if any American states, or any other country has a similar defence, but if not, I hope this discussion doesn't give them any ideas, knowing the extent of homophobia to be found virtually everywhere in the world.
I might add that, surprise surprise, it has been conservative (reactionary branch)governments which have passed this law, and in fact two more state governments now ruled by conservatives (reactionary branch)are considering installing similar legislation. Oh yes, oddly enough the leaders of these governments are all self-identified devout Christians.
Christ all frigging mighty.
I am rapidly developing fantasies of getting a Uzi and assassinating as many reactionary politicians as I can before the police kill me. I'm dying anyway, just a bit slower than from violence, so what the hell. Note: I did say fantasies.
I wish Atlas would bloody shrug. Then maybe human beings could run the world.
Lash
3 people like this
10 responses
@AidaLily (1450)
• United States
22 Aug 12
"Gay panic" defense?
Well, to be completely and utterly honest, that is the dumbest thing I have heard in a long time. I don't even know if i can articulate exactly how idiotic that sounds to me.
There is not a "gay panic" defense here in America, but there is a "temporary insanity" one.
The real question is why do people keep voting idiots into office. That is not panic, it is murder.
I have long since left any illusions that the so-called christians of today have any actual morals. Feelings of entitlement? yes. Actually morals, decency, or you know actually reading the bible have long been forgotten. I am not surprised that these self identified devout christians as you call them would condone murder. Most of them.. not all.. but most condone murder, discrimination, and much more that all goes against the teachings of their so-called savior.
It reminds me of something in the U.S. where a conservative candidate for senate said doctors told him women can't get pregnant from "legitimate" rape.
No man would go psychotic at the horror of it. There is a simple thing called common sense. You tell the person no. Some people may even need a punch to the face (not that I condone it), but there is never a need for senseless murder. I swear all these conservative pseudo christian idiots are going to send the world into the dark ages.... and then complain because they don't like it.
@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
22 Aug 12
Aida, I have taken to referring to that particular branch of politics and religion that can be defined as "reactionary", and those are the slimy vipers we have to watch out for. As a Green, I have a basic belief in conservation, and that can mean conserving the things that are valuable, so I still have some supposedly (moderate) conservative, but these people, either in politics as reactionaries or in religion as fundamentalists, are a genuine threat to the whole of humankind.
I have never been able to find a difference between the extreme left and the extreme right, so I have no difficulty in seeing someone like these types in the same light that I see Hitler, or Stalin, or Pol Pot. I love M. C. Escher's work because he has such a wonderful way of showing the symmetry involved.
Lash
@purplealabaster (22085)
• United States
22 Aug 12
The thing that I find the most ironic and at the same time the most revolting is that many of these people that would agree with the "gay panic" defense to condone murder would be opposed to abortion, because abortion is murder and murder is wrong.
These people have absolutely no problem contradicting themselves and using the same "proof" to support both sides (usually excepts from the Bible) when it suits them.

These people have absolutely no problem contradicting themselves and using the same "proof" to support both sides (usually excepts from the Bible) when it suits them.
@AidaLily (1450)
• United States
22 Aug 12
There isn't many differences between the extreme left and right except for the methods in which they go about it.
"Reactionary" sounds like a good term to use for this particular type of government and religion. However, I still believe anyone who can condone murder using politics and/or religion is an idiot.
Mainly because they (the reactionary group) think of the right now and not the big picture. How would those politicians react should they have a family member who is killed and someone and their buddies claim it was self defense as they were in a state of "gay panic"? Does anyone ever think past that moment especially when making laws to impact a nation?
I don't really see much of a difference between extremists and terrorists. However, many people here will claim they are not being extreme, but merely aggressively pushing their ideas on to everyone else regardless of if results in murdering innocent people.

@sid556 (30953)
• United States
24 Aug 12
It's not much different from the women who get away with murder because they were abused for years. Good lord, give me a freakin break. We have so many programs to help them. Murder is never ok and abuse to fight abuse is not either. Rape is a crime and a legit one. Attempted rape...yup...nail the guy. Making someone feel awkward for unwanted advances? An adult? Should not be a crime.

@sid556 (30953)
• United States
24 Aug 12
Hi Grandpa,
I left an abusive marriage. I got councelling when I left as well as did a lot of reading on the issues of abuse and why women put up with it. I admittedly know little as to the mental suffering that would cause a woman to go to the extent of physically harming or killing her abuser. I put up with it for too long but I guess I was lucky in that I got out prior to reaching that point. You would think that having been in such a situation that I'd be more empathetic.
@sid556 (30953)
• United States
25 Aug 12
Ya, my ex was really pretty bad. The woman's upbring also plays a large role in the whole scenario...whether or not she gets out before the abuse esculates to such a dangerous degree. Oh I got your discussion way off topic and I didn't mean to at all. The story you just told me is chilling and I can clearly see how this could happen. In that case it is self-defense. In the case of gays...that law is also very chilling. I hope it does not catch on. It's horrible! 

@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
24 Aug 12
sid, there is a world of difference between a homophobic man (or woman, I suppose) lashing out at a pass, and a woman suffering battered wife syndrome. It is called a syndrome because it is a mental condition brought about by years of abuse and fear. Sure, there will be some smarties who claim they are suffering from it to get away with murder, but that doesn't negate the validity of the condition.
Lash
1 person likes this

@Hatley (163772)
• Garden Grove, California
22 Aug 12
hi grandpa lash how sickening and pathetic. and horribly evil
How do they get away with it unless a lot of so called
religious people get in cahoots with the conservatives.I
think this is so sick. also how can anyone call themselves
C hristians and act like that and uphold such a sick defense.I
hope this does not get on the books here in the US.





@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
22 Aug 12
As opposed to laws based around "legitimate" rape lol. Depends on whether your general population votes for idiots from the far reactionary right. Then anything is possible.
Lash
@JenInTN (27514)
• United States
25 Aug 12
I have heard of some ridiculous defenses before but that has to take the cake. Your right about the woman and the abusive spouse. There are still laws here in certain states that condone spousal abuse and some that have just recently been lifted. I have never heard of the likes of that though. Wow..I will have to try and see if there is anything like that here. I am hoping not but one never knows these days.
@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
26 Aug 12
See Lamb's response. What is most disturbing here is that one state had repealed this law, but the Right wing government now in power wants to relegislate.
Lash
@RawBill1 (8531)
• Gold Coast, Australia
23 Aug 12
Hmm, which state in Australia are these? I have been propositioned by men three times over the years and all three were in Victoria! One was by a politician from Canberra! Maybe I look like a gay man or something, I don't know?
My wife has also been pinched on the bum by a woman when she was reading a lesbianism book one time. She just picked it up out of curiosity at the same time as this woman walked past.
The more and more I hear about laws in our so called civilised world, it drives me to just want to go off and live the hermit life in the bush somewhere. All these rules and regulations and stupid laws such as this one are beyond my comprehension of logic. Atlas Shrugged. I keep looking at that and meaning to read it. We have it here, but I keep avoiding it!
My wife has also been pinched on the bum by a woman when she was reading a lesbianism book one time. She just picked it up out of curiosity at the same time as this woman walked past.
The more and more I hear about laws in our so called civilised world, it drives me to just want to go off and live the hermit life in the bush somewhere. All these rules and regulations and stupid laws such as this one are beyond my comprehension of logic. Atlas Shrugged. I keep looking at that and meaning to read it. We have it here, but I keep avoiding it! @grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
23 Aug 12
NT, SA, NSW, and Qld, and Victoria had it and now is wanting it back.
I suppose everybody should read Atlas once, but you'll find it is like listening to Tony Abbott for three days without a break. Her idea of beauty is a valley of mills and furnaces, clouded with smoke and fire and ash, the beauty lying in the productivity and the wealth created by that production.
Libertarians (shudder) like her a lot.
Lash
@purplealabaster (22085)
• United States
22 Aug 12
First, I want to know why it is only men that can use this "gay panic" defense ... what about women that get propositioned by other women? Are women also allowed to use this defense, and if not then why not? Don't misunderstand me, I think it is disgusting, but it does make me wonder about the gender distinction.
Also, along the same lines only different, are women allowed to kill revolting, disgusting guys that proposition them due to some kind of "panic" at the thought of such a repulsive creature potentially trying to touch them or whatever?
I know that I might be considered a little "weird" or whatever, but I would by far prefer to be propositioned by a good looking, nice woman with a good personality than an overbearing jerk who thinks that he is "God's gift to women" and is a "legend in his own mind", even though I am heterosexual. In both instances, however, I could easy decline their advances without having to resort to murder and in most cases without ever having to get "physical" at all.

@sid556 (30953)
• United States
24 Aug 12
Actually, you are not being weird at all Purple. Those are very valid and logical questions and concerns. Most concerning here of all is that ordinary people like us have to question them at all when the people that are in charge and running this country are the people we are questioning. This kind of scares me more than a little. Why do we have more common sense than the people in control?
@grandpa_lash (5225)
• Australia
23 Aug 12
You echo exactly the points sharra2 raised with me at the next computer lol. I imagine a smart lawyer would use the Gay Panic dfense in the female version you mention, but I can't imagine a woman reacting that way, so it's pretty much a moot point. Of course if a woman tried a Hetero Panic defense she'd be dragged out of court by hysterically laughing prison guards.
Of course, in a society where many men have still not grasped the fact the NO means NO, what can you expect?
Lash
@AidaLily (1450)
• United States
24 Aug 12
@purple: I would also want to know if this applies to married women who still get hit on by men who think they are god's gift to women when it is quite obvious they are married due to some kind of panic. The gender distinction is a little odd though.
I don't understand why they can resort to murder instead of saying no or declining and at most (though as I have stated I am not big on violence in other posts) a punch to the face should the person be overly pushy and aggressive.
@sid556: The answer to your question is simple. Idiots follow idiots. Idiots can easily relate to other idiots. The people with common sense are usually ignored and called crazy. No idiot wants a person who is smart and has common sense in control. That would destroy the control and/or people wouldn't be able to relate because they don't have that much common sense.
Sad, but true.
@urbandekay (18278)
•
23 Aug 12
Indeed a ridiculous and insane law but politicians are hoars to media and other pressures. Was there some campaign in the press?
all the best urban
@crossbones27 (52979)
• Mojave, California
23 Aug 12
Congratulations, sounds like you have your very own stand your ground law. I have to say yours is a bit worse because it actually brings lawful discrimination into the picture. What ever happened to politely saying "no I don't swing that way." I have never had a problem with a gay dude as long as I told them that. I live in California so I would know.
@stary1 (6611)
• United States
25 Aug 12
I have never heard of this
...but it certainly falls within the rule that extremism is pretty much always the wrong reaction. I am pretty sure you were kidding about the 'Uzi' or I would criticize that.
I don't think you can blame conservatism for all these ills...I believe it's extremism that causes problems.. be it left or right..
...but it certainly falls within the rule that extremism is pretty much always the wrong reaction. I am pretty sure you were kidding about the 'Uzi' or I would criticize that.
I don't think you can blame conservatism for all these ills...I believe it's extremism that causes problems.. be it left or right..






