Does God Exist? - Physics Professor Says He Has Proof.

@gifana (4838)
Portugal
May 11, 2007 5:55am CST
Has anyone seen the video on Yahoo news concerning the question Does God Exist? It seems that Frank Tipier, Ph.D., a professor of mathmatics in Tulane University says he can prove that god is real. He says, "It's coming out not of paleontology or religious mysticism but that of hard-nosed physics which is what I like." After seeing the video and listening to him I still have my doubts that he can "prove" it. He fills blackboards with formulas, which I, who have never studied mathmatics, let alone physics, see as hen stratching. I don't doubt his intelligence but scientists have studied this for centuries and never found proof. What makes Tipler think he knows more. Any comments?
8 people like this
22 responses
• Thailand
12 May 07
Why do we need a god? I dono't believe in him and my world has the same natural beauty as dose the world of someone who believes. I am a compassionate and tolerant person and I do not need a supernatural sky god to make me so. God is not going to suddenly appear out of a Physics equitation. There have been a lot of gods in history. All eventually devolve into myth and the current one will follow in due time.
3 people like this
@annieroos (1846)
• United States
12 May 07
You may not beleieve in him.. its your opinion.. but where do you think that beautiful natural world came from? It didn't appear out of thin air just like you and me.. Just look at yourself in the mirror or look at everything around you.. that is all the proof you need.. but its your opinion..
2 people like this
• Thailand
13 May 07
I can find all the proof in a rational approach to the world and the universe beyond. I am filled with wonder at the immensity and beauty of it. I find much more happiness in asking questions and searching for the answers than I ever could in accepting that I should not question because God made it so. I love life and feel a shared kinship with all living things on this planet. What do I need a god or gods for?
2 people like this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
Chiang....just out of curiosity are you a Buddhist? It seems to me that your thinking is very close to what little I know about Buddism which doctrine lends itself to nature and the natural wonders of the world in which we live. You may be right that in the millenia to follow all religions per se will devolve into myths and disappear. If that happens, what will mankind have to inspire him? Thanks for dropping by. +
1 person likes this
@010878 (303)
• Indonesia
11 May 07
First of all you need to decide which God are you refering to ? God in christian beliefs or in moslem beliefs or other religions. Pagans for examples believes in many Gods and Goddesses. You can't prove that God or whatever name you refer to does exist. But sometimes you can feel Him/Her insides of you. Most people have experience something they can't explain with logical thoughts because it's beyond logical. Some people are so into logical/rational thoughts that they refuse to see there's something out there. Maybe their reason for refusal based on fear. Fear for something unknown. I'm not a really good christian but I'm a true believer of Jesus Christ. I've learn paganism and other beliefs as well. Not because I want to mix all those beliefs and religions but because I want to understand why people believes in those religions. I'm really comfortable with paganism/wicca but I can't deny that my GOD and savious is Jesus Christ. When I was a little boy I got a really high fever that made my parents in real panicked. And they told me that I blabbing something incoherent. The truth is I saw someone standing watching me in the corner of the room. I knew that He was Jesus. I have experienced many unexplainable events now that really makes me hard to ignore the facts that there is GOD.
@annieroos (1846)
• United States
12 May 07
Wow thats interesting.. to have that experience.. I believe there is One God who loves us all.. Everyone beleives in Their own ways.. But one God created all mankind.. and the world we live in.. I Do Beleive there is a God
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
You make a very valid point. I agree that there are happenings that we or anyone else can understand. That certainly doesn't mean they are invalid. I find it hard, sometimes, to believe in God because of the inconsistencies. For example, how can God be so "cruel" to let a child suffer excruciatingly when he has done nothing to deserve such "punishment"? Why do the good die young and the bad go on causing more pain and suffering to others? Thanks for dropping by and for your input...very informative. +
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
annie...I was brought up with that theory and I believed it for a long time. I still believe that is a higher being but like Thomas, I now have to see to believe. Thanks for dropping by. +
@victorwzj (539)
11 May 07
I never seen that clip or read any of those on yahoo but majority of people already believing in god weather there are prove or no prove. It is something that the follower need to have faith for and I know it is sound like blind believe. For example people are blindly believing that the god exist because of what jesus say so it doesn't need prove. There are no mathematics or science in the world that can prove something that you cannot see , hear and touch to be exist thus again it is down to faith alone. Well there are thing that exist without five of our sense detecting them but that doesn't mean that "that" is god. In many religion God is a being that have many superpower and are the one that create the universe and along with everything else.
2 people like this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
I don't see that blindly believe that God exists because of what Jesus said but rather what his followers said that he said which in itself doesn't prove anything. Does that mean that the oxygen we breathe does not exist because we cannot see, hear or touch it and therefore only exists because we have faith that it exists? Thanks for dropping by. +
1 person likes this
14 May 07
Well we actually have prove that the oxygen are exist even in atom level and for example water = h20 / combination of two hydrogen and oxygen . But God is a being that we clearly doesn't have prove that HE/SHE exist. Who knows maybe one day we achieve enough technological advancement we are able to somehow prove that the God are exist.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
15 May 07
If, as you say God is a "being" then why can't he be seen? Thanks for coming back again. +
@natalie1981 (2000)
• Singapore
12 May 07
I believe that God exists, I don't have proof but I can sense it. I've watched this show a few years ago and I loved the way they put it into this analogy...Scientists believed that the earth's center is made up of an iron core (or something), nobody actually dug deep enough to get to the center of the earth but every scientists believes this because we feel it in what we call, gravity. It's the same way as God, nobody actually saw him but for those of us who believes in him, we actually feel that his presence in our lives. Just my two cents. :)
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
But some did see Him in the form of Jesus. This is "proven" in the Holy Trinity.....The Father, The Son and the Hold Ghost....as the hymn Holy, Holy, Holy, ends....God in three persons, blessed Trinity. Or is that a figment of the writers' imagination. Your opinion is worth more than two cents natalie. +
2 people like this
• Singapore
14 May 07
Thanks. I don't doubt that other might have seen Him, the problem is with the disbelievers who would probably ask me if I myself have seen Him so I guess my only retort would be my answer above. LOL.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
That certainly makes perfect sense, natalie. Thanks for coming back. +
@dita13 (431)
• Indonesia
11 May 07
GOD do exists!
2 people like this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
11 May 07
That is your opinion but do you have any proof? +
@dita13 (431)
• Indonesia
11 May 07
If you see. Who else that make this world happened? What makes things can be done? Who can make the beautiful nature? and so many other questions that related to GOD. GOD do exists! The answers for my question is GOD!
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
I see your point but it still is just a belief or an opinion. What we see around us could well be a result of physics as much as the Hand of God. Thanks for coming back. +
@annieroos (1846)
• United States
12 May 07
IN my opinion God does exist.. I don't need to give proof and i don't need to see proof to know that he exist.. I know that without God i would not be here.. none of us would.. If God didn't exist.. There would be no love in this world...I believe the bible..and listen to the bible more then i would listen to any professors.. I think thats just something they do to try and lead people away from their bleifs.. I know there is a God he lives with us all and in our hearts.. He is my world And i thank him everyday for everything i am and i have.. with out him i would have nothing or be nothing
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
I respect your beliefs. As I have said in other comments I was brought up beleiveing but as I grew up and saw a lot of degradation in the world it started me doubting His existence based on what is happening in this world by many of its inhabitants. Thanks for dropping by. +
@eaforeman6 (8983)
• United States
12 May 07
i would like to hear what he has to say and not because i dont believe. I have always believed and would still like to hear what this man has to say. what is the link or location of this information, please?
2 people like this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
I really couldn't tell you what he said exactly. He was exaplaining the existence using a blackboard and writing a formula. Not having any understanding of physics it was way over my head.. I looked for the video on Yahoo News (ABC News) again before making comments hoping to find a link to post but it wasn't on their any more. I know it was about the time of the Queen's visit as I was watching those videos. Sorry. +
@MySpot (2602)
• United States
11 May 07
It would help if you'd shared a link to the video. I watched a great movie called, "What the Bleep Do We Know...Down the Rabbit Hole" where Science, Spirituality, Quantum Physics experts and other scholars compared notes and it gives interesting points of view about God, existence and how we are all connected. It also shows us how cause and effect works and how thoughts are things describing how perception works. My favorite part is where they explain that we DO NOT see with ours eyes but INSTEAD, our brains... which explains sooo much! Think about it... how does a 60 pound anorexic look in the mirror and still see a fat person in the reflection??? Because it's their brain (perception/thought) that is 'seeing'! It gives a whole new meaning to, "Seeing is Believing" because actually, "Believing is SEEING"!!!
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
Wow, your thoughts are titillating to say the least. I'm sorry about not sharing the link. I just assumed that the video on Yahoo News. However, I just tried to find the video again and was unsuccessful. I will not make the same mistake again, believe me. I agree with the idea that we do not see with our eyes but with our brains. I have always concurred with the idea of Seeing is Believing but am not sure how to react to "believing is seeing" mainly because I if I believe in God that it is because I see Him....which I never have. Thanks for dropping by. +
@tuposkid (286)
• United States
11 May 07
It is physically impossible to "prove" Gods existence 100%. But there is overwhelming evidence that He is real. For instance. Take the old testament prophecies about a messiah. The odds of ANY OTHER MAN besides Jesus Christ fulfilling all of them comes out to around 1 : 1 with 10 zeros behind it. Evidence is overwhelming. That is just one of many many evidences. Another is this. People don't believe the bible, but they believe other manuscripts that have been found yes? People read homers writings and they claim they are real. Something like 20 ORIGINAL manuscripts were found on the Odysee and people say that it is Homers original work... Now the bible? Well over 500 original manuscripts have been found... Odds are stacked that the bible is real...
1 person likes this
@Tanya8 (1734)
• Canada
11 May 07
OK, I'll answer your question. You're making an invalid comparison between the content of the Bible and the fact that Homer's work exists. No one doubts the Bible exists; you can walk into any church, and find a copy. It's the supernatural parts of the Bible's content that people who don't believe in God tend to question. Likewise, you won't find to many people who believe the Scylla and Charybdis really exist as a result of reading The Odyssey.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
tupo the old testament prophecies were based on the Jewish faith as christianity did not exist at the time. That is why they accept Jesus Christ only as the prophesized "messiah". The Jews are still waiting for the "coming of the Messiah" while the Christians are awaiting for the "second coming of Jesus Christ, who to the Christians is the promised Messiah. I ask you...which is correct? The tablets and manuscripts that have been found, translated and interpreted is no proof that God existed or exists. Thanks for dropping by. +
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
Tanya. No ones doubts that there is a Holy Bible it's the validity of the contents of the Bible that some people doubt. One can also walk into many hotels in the United States and find a Gideon Bible in every room. While I have not read The Odyssey in its entirety I always looked upon the saga as a literary work based on myths rather than reality. Thanks for dropping by. +
• United States
15 May 07
I have not seen the video from Yahoo News, however, it is my opinion that no one can "prove" any god exists anymore than they can "prove" BigFoot lives in the woods by my home. People believe because in the existence because they want to, need to, or are expected to. Personally, I NEED to explore the how and why of things rather than just conform like a brainwashed child, similar to the members of the Jim Jones' cult. I find it disgusting that people fill their children's heads with speculative nonsense requiring them to adhere to and "obey" a God and Bible that is based on instilling fear "or else". My studies have proven (to me) that IF a God existed, then the bible itself would be a blasphemous injustice to him, and that the NT and story of Jesus is nearly identical to the mythology of many, many characters before him (Mithras, Horus, etc). There are many parables, poems, and stories of the bible I enjoy reading. Beyond this, I hear people speak of miracles from God, of praying and hearing answers or being given direction. It is my conclusion that there IS a higher power, but one that we have not even scratched the surface of...similar to the power of the laying of hands and focused "prayer", and in the way mediums can focus and weild energy fields, or people can "sense" things before they happen, I believe these energies are part of all life - including us. That they ebb, flow, contradict with and complement one another. Believers call them miracles from God. A boy with a high fever will be prone to delusionary visions (earlier post) and coupled with his belief in Jesus and God, his senses may have manifested this "vision". I feel there is a scientific explanation for everything, absent of religion or Gods. Just as dogs can hear pitches of sound that we can't, I think there are planes of abilities we cannot sense or otherwise feel....yet. I wonder also if we are on the verge of another evolutionary split, in which our brains are (for lack of a better word) "expanding" to move beyond some of the mysteries we have faced for so long. Prehistoric man began as beings who were in awe of natural phenomena such as lightning, night, moon, eclipse, drought, etc. Look at how far our brains have advanced since then! It is amazing. Perhaps one group or the other (between the faithfully religious groups encompassing over 35,000 different-belief systems and divisions at this point, and those seeking solid answers without religious expectations hindering progression) is destined to evolve further than the other in a relatively short period of time to come??
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
15 May 07
What a wonderful dissertation. Would that more people could read it and see both sides of the story rather than one jaded opinion. What you said makes sense in a way that sets the cogs moving in the brain to cogitate and compute. I am sure that this subject is destined to evolve further in both directions until the circle is complete and there will be a major agreement that would keep mankind from eliminating itself by war. I have enjoyed this very much. Thank you. If I had another Best Respone to give out I would be more than happy to but all I can do is give you a + rating. +
• United States
16 May 07
Thank you so much for your kind words. A "+" is just fine by me. ;) Very nice discussion, I enjoy participating when people can discuss ideas rather than judge. You've been a great hostess to your topic.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
16 May 07
And you are a most gracious guest. Thank you. +
11 May 07
I'm not sure mathematics and the proof of God does go together myself, but then I do not believe in God and I would more than formulas as evidence. I always wonder what happens to people who have never been influenced by any religion. Do they ever find God for themselves through visions or just feelings or does it always have to be taught to us by another human being. My children have not been taught any religion, have never attended church and thankfully do not have the fear that they are going to burn in hell if they do wrong. They have never once asked me if they could attend a church or follow a religion, both actually don't believe in anything. They see and often comment that the belief in God has brought about much distruction and war in the world. I see God as man made to keep us under control, as most religions are not about freedom of choice, but the rule to follow what is preached by man. If there really was a God it would be ashamed at what it has created. Its invention of testosterone has caused alot of pain and disaster. For the amount of people who do believe in this world they could make such a difference to all the poor and abused people in this world instead of just worrying about going to heaven. This place is going to be very empty if they believe it exists. Will the Catholic church take all their wealth to the kingdom of heaven!! Sorry, get me onto God and I just find the whole thing a brain washing cult.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
Very interesting point of view. Just curious but have you ever heard your children use the phrase "thank God" which is a very common place? If so, why? The idea of God being "man-made" is not farfetched as the human being is prone to "brainwashing". I, too, question why there have been so many conflicts over the last two millenia over religious beliefs. Some clerics have been so audace as to say that it is God's way to control overpopulation....if you can imagine. A lot of people think that giving a dime or two in church or to some beggar or to charity is worth the price of admission to Heaven. Did you ever read the book by Morris West, The Shoes of the Fisherman? It was also a movie starring Anthony Quinn as a Russian priest who was released from a Siberian Gulag, made a Cardinal and then became Pope. In order to save the world from Russian threat he told the world that he would sell the Church's relics and treasure to buy food to end world famine in answer to the Communist leaders threat. That is something that I, as a non-practicing Catholic, would very much like to see. The Vatican is recognized as the largest business organization in the world....yet at Sunday mass the priests very seldom ask for a second offering to help the flood victims in Mozambique, the starving in Timbuctu and lord knows what all. If the Vatican used the profits they make on the stock markets around the world it could feed millions of starving children. No need to apolotize for your opinions. I too sometimes get carried away on the subject. +
1 person likes this
14 May 07
As far as I know my children have never said God within any expressions they have made, as they have no connection with it at all. What you have said makes so much sense and it makes me sad as well as angry that one of the most powerful corporate businesses happens to be the Catholic church. They preach to the poor while they sit in their wealth. This world is truely a mad place and only the few seem to have the sense to see what is really going on. I hope if there is an afterlife we all meet together and see what madness has happened, not to gloat, but to realise we are individuals and have not be brainwashed by the powermongers of this world. Thank goodness we are strong in mind and do not need to follow a cult to be at one in this world. If I get there before you I will send you a postcard!!
1 person likes this
@kathy77 (7488)
• Australia
11 May 07
No I have not seen any video on Yahoo. So you think that he is wrong do you. As for myself I have faith in God and do believe that he exists and one day hopefully it will not be too late that you will realize that their is a God only one belief me he is the creator of all. Years ago scientists never believe that God exists but they have proven that there there is now.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
No kathy I am not saying that he is wrong nor do I agree with him. I am in no man's land on the issue. I was brought up to believe in God but for various and sundry reasons in my life as well as in the rest of the world it leads me to question what kind of God He is. I like to have a logical reason to the things that happen, especially to me. I have stated some of my questions in other comments so I will not repeat them. I have to admit that I do pray for others and ask that He tend to them in their needs. I have conversations with Him every once in a while but it never involves me. I do this because the others have asked for my help through prayers and if my praying will help them I feel I cannot refuse just because I have questions. As far as the scientists are concerned from what I have read they tend to follow the logic of evolution....which to my way of thinking has not really been proven either. Always nice to see you kathy. +
@dbeast (1499)
• India
11 May 07
i would defnitely like to see someone prove the existence of God but i have a gut feeling there will not be anyone who can.no one can prove there is a super power above.it all lies in the faith of the people.i believe all the evolution of human beings and all is pure science.it is not that i am discouraging people who believe in God,these are my thoughts.i will not believe in God until i see some proff.i believe more on myself.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
I can't say as want someone to prove God's existence. Perhaps the evidence of proof would have a surprising effect on mankind as sometimes the "Truth" hurts rather than heals. It could be that God is more real because he is a "figment of the imagination" and the unknown is oft times more useful as long as it remains in the realm of the unknown certainty. Thanks for dropping by. +
@nesha23 (31)
• United States
11 May 07
God is real and i don't think no diffrent than that and anyone who do not think so just read the holy bible.Godbless
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
14 May 07
I have read the Holy Bible and I am still unsure that He is real. Do you believe everything that you read? I don't but I try to understand other's points of view to reach my own conclusions. The Bible is an interesting History Book but how can we be sure that those who translated the stones and hearsay understood the true meanings? Thanks for dropping by. +
• India
11 May 07
ya i too believe in god but the above one is not understaandable or doesnot support asnything
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
It is difficult to understand but to say that it does not support anything would be an injustice. Were he able to write in his own tongue, it would probably make more sense to us. Thanks for dropping by. +
@froster (13)
• India
11 May 07
I think that there is no god. It is belive in ourself which think that there exist god, by thinking so it help ourself to tell everything to them ask everything to them.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say other than perhaps you do not believe that God does not exist. +
@jerinvar (42)
• India
11 May 07
Another Da Vicni Code in the making I guess :).i believe there`s God and He`s seeing everything what you are doing.He is everything for me.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
I don't think so. You say He sees everything that you do...how does that influence you in what you do? Are you afraid to do something that He might not consider good? If so, that He is to be feared. I don't think so. Thanks for dropping by. +
@me_cute (15)
• India
11 May 07
its all about faith...if u think he exists he does n noone can make u change ur mind
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
Okay. But just because I think He exists does not make it so. He exists only because people say he exists....the Bible is comprised of translations, interpretations and who knows what else. I don't find that sufficient proof. Thanks for dropping by. +
• Nigeria
11 May 07
The truth is this if we look at our lifes and everything around us and you find out that there are some things we don't have control over then we will realise that God is real
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
That is the popular belief. But sometimes I see God's work go against the Christian teachings. How do you explain why God saves the undeserving and allows the good to suffer? Thanks for dropping by. +
@Tanya8 (1734)
• Canada
11 May 07
I can't seem to find the video. I did read The Anthropic Principle that he wrote with John Barrow in the 80s, and remember finding it unconvincing. Although the authors didn't state it outright, it seemed they were starting from the assumption that a higher power existed, and making phyiscs fit that assumption without addressing any of the obvious arguments to the contrary. If you look at the Wikipedia article on Tipler, you can see that his views are controversial and seen as conjecture more than as science.
1 person likes this
@gifana (4838)
• Portugal
13 May 07
The video was on Yahoo news with the same title as this discussion. I will not disagree with what you say here. I also am not saying that I agree with his idea according to physics. I am not in a position to evaluate what he has to say merely that it tempered my curiosity. I cannot prove or disprove the fact but I simply have a few doubts. Sometimes I think evolution is the truth and sometimes the bible is truth. There is no exact proof of either. Thanks for dropping by tanya and for your pointing out some things about Tipler. +