Packers, Steelers - What's the Difference Anyway??
By anniepa
@anniepa (27955)
United States
July 12, 2008 2:16am CST
We all know GOP Presidential candidate John McCain's service to our country and status as a war hero is without question and I've said many times how much I respect him for what he must have gone through as a POW in Vietnam for five years. Nothing can take that away from him or change the facts. His heroics have been documented in his 1999 best-selling memoir, Faith of My Fathers which was also made in to a movie of the same title. Here's an excerpt from the book:
"“Once my condition had stabilized, my interrogators resumed their work. Demands for military information were accompanied by threats to terminate my medical treatment if I did not cooperate. Eventually, I gave them my ship’s name and squadron number, and confirmed that my target had been the power plant. Pressed for more useful information, I gave the names of the Green Bay Packers offensive line, and said they were members of my squadron. When asked to identify future targets, I simply recited the names of a number of North Vietnamese cities that had already been bombed.”"
Now, let's fast forward to July 10, 2008. Yesterday in Pittsburgh, Sen. John McCain, professed his love for the Steelers to KDKA-TV.
http://boards.msn.com/MSNBCboards/thread.aspx?threadid=720512
Here's part of that interview:
"Asked what first comes to his mind when he thinks of Pittsburgh, McCain chuckled, "the Steelers. I was a mediocre high school athlete but I loved and adored the sports but the Steelers really made a huge impression on me particularly in my early years."
And then McCain told a rather moving story about his time as a P.O.W. "When I was first interrogated and really had to give some information because of the pressures, physical pressures on me, I named the starting lineup, defensive line of the Pittsburgh Steelers as my squadron mates."
"Did you really?" asked the reporter.
"Yes," McCain said.
"In your POW camp?" asked the reporter.
"Yes," McCain said.
"Could you do it today?" asked the reporter.
"No, unfortunately," McCain said. "
So, was this a memory lapse, did McCain actually believe it had been the Steelers' lineup he'd recited all those years ago? Would that same "senior moment" have occurred had this interview taken place in, say...Wisconsin? Basically, do you think this obvious and well-documented "gaffe" is not big deal or does it bother you, and if it does how MUCH does it bother you?
Do you believe John McCain was shamelessly pandering in Pittsburgh or did he just make an honest mistake and if it was a mistake is it a big enough one to cause concern over his ability to be Commander-In-Chief? I'm not attacking anything
in his past but I'm more than a little worried about our future if he were to be elected.
Annie
1 person likes this
6 responses
@Katlady2 (9904)
• United States
12 Jul 08
To be honest, that doesn't really bother me. Yes, he could have had a "senior moment" back then, or he could have just been bluffing the people that were interrogating hime to save his own hide. I sincerely hope that it was the latter. To have someone in office in such a high power postion that suffers from memory lapses (more than normal) would be devastating for our country indeed.
1 person likes this
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
12 Jul 08
I'm afraid you misunderstood; he was definitely "bluffing" the interrogators back then, that isn't in question at all and that certainly isn't a problem. He gave the names of the Green Bay Packers football team in answer to a question from his captors. The problem is NOW that although he told of this incident in the book he himself wrote and it was shown in the movie made based on that book not once but twice, plus he's told this story many, many times through the years, always telling it to have been the PACKERS whose players he named under interrogation. It wasn't until this past Thursday, July 10 that he told a Pittsburgh reporter, while stomping for votes in Pittsburgh, Pa. that when he thinks of Pittsburgh he thinks of the Steelers because of this incident in which he named the Steelers line-up while being interrogated as a POW in Vietnam.
I'm sorry, I know McCain supporters disagree with me here and that's fine, it's your right, but I have a huge problem with this no matter what the "truth" is. For him to have forgotten something like this which had been a big deal in his life, the very thing he's running his campaign on, would be beyond frightening and when you put this together with his confusion of Sunnis and Shiites four times in as many days, it's horrifying to think this man will have his finger on the button. On the other hand, if he felt he could get away with this kind of pandering by claiming it was the Steelers he named because he happened to be campaigning in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania - a state he probably can't win without and faces a big challenge in - well, that doesn't say much about his honesty or integrity and raises doubt if the story were ever even true at all, Packers or Steelers.
Annie
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@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
12 Jul 08
That's all pretty meaningless to me. It happened a long time ago so I don't see how it matters whether he remembers the specific team's offensive or defensive line. Perhaps if he was in Wisconsin he'd be specifically avoiding telling people that he named the Packers offensive line. The cheeseheads might think he was betraying their team to the enemy and lynch him.
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@anniepa (27955)
• United States
12 Jul 08
What makes this far from meaningless in my opinion is that he put it in his book about how he'd named the Packers' line-up in an act of defiance, as it was worded but the other day he changed the story to say it was the names of the Steelers that he'd recited to his captors. Seriously, that doesn't concern you that he just happened to claim to have named the Steelers while being interrogated while in Pittsburgh? I'm pretty sure if it had been Obama making a gaffe like this one it would be all over the place, especially here on myLot.
Annie
@Taskr36 (13963)
• United States
12 Jul 08
That's an impossible conclusion to draw about Obama Annie and you know it. Obama has never served in the military and subsequently has never done any act of defiance even remotely similar to what McCain has described. I can't even imagine a way that Obama could make a minutely similar mistake.
What exactly are you trying to imply this means? Are you saying that he will just go from state to state claiming he listed the line from the local team? I really think this is a simple mistake and not something he would intentionally do.
1 person likes this
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
12 Jul 08
"That's an impossible conclusion to draw about Obama Annie and you know it. Obama has never served in the military and subsequently has never done any act of defiance even remotely similar to what McCain has described. I can't even imagine a way that Obama could make a minutely similar mistake."
I didn't mean it necessarily had to be something pertaining to the military. You're right, though, since there hasn't been something really similar involving Obama it's impossible to know what the reaction would be, that was just me giving my opinion...lol...which you know I love to do! However, it has been posted here quite a few times that Obama had said there were 57 states, which I don't think I heard the particular comment but I would assume that was a simple case of misspeaking. Also mentioned here has been a time when Obama apparently was confused as to which city he was in and in that case I think he may have confused Sioux Falls with Sioux City, something I've done myself in reference to the hometown of a race car driver we once followed.
"What exactly are you trying to imply this means? Are you saying that he will just go from state to state claiming he listed the line from the local team? I really think this is a simple mistake and not something he would intentionally do."
Taskr, I'm really not "trying to imply this means" anything, it was something I'd just heard about last night on TV and thought it would make an interesting discussion topic, nothing more, nothing less. I'm not a McCain supporter as you know so I'll honestly admit I really don't know what my reaction to this would be if I were. One thing I must say is since McCain and his supporters have made his military service and his history as a POW, which I'm not nor will I ever criticize or attack, the hallmark of his Presidential campaign it would seem that forgetting this kind of detail which had been told and retold many times isn't all that trivial. Since the story broke in the lead-off to the weekend I'd guess every effort to sweep it under the rug will be made.
Annie
@Angelwhispers (8978)
• United States
13 Jul 08
I have not heard this yet Annie. It is comically sad. I have no clue or opinion here i just wanted you to know I read it and found it disturbing as well.
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@anniepa (27955)
• United States
1 Sep 08
I posted this discussion over two months ago but I still find it disturbing not only that he did this - either forgot or lied - and you and I are the only ones here that think it means a thing! I mean, which do you want, a President that is so delusional he really now believes it was the Steelers' roster he recited despite writing it in his book and telling the story over and over again in interviews and always claiming it was the Packers, or do we want a liar who will say whatever he thinks the person he's talking to wants to hear? I'll have to check around, he's done a lot of traveling in two months so who knows, he's probably also named the Jets, the Dolphins, the 49ers, the Giants and the Panthers...which would be really cool since they didn't exist back then...lol!
Annie
@skinnychick (6905)
• United States
12 Jul 08
It doesn't worry me all that much. There are plenty of people who can't remember things like that from 30 years ago. I don't like McCain as much as the next guy but this isn't a big deal.
1 person likes this
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
12 Jul 08
Like I said, it wasn't just some minor little detail from years ago, it was something he'd allegedly done in defiance while being interrogated as a POW and he'd put it into his personal memoir which became a best-seller and was made into a movie, which depicted that particular scene twice where he named members of that year's Green Bay Packers team. Two days ago, while being interviewed in Pittsburgh all of a sudden the Steelers is what he thinks of when he thinks of Pittsburgh because of this incident in which he now claims he named the Steelers. Pandering? A true case of forgetting? Somehow either bothers me.
Annie
@skinnychick (6905)
• United States
13 Jul 08
LOL Annie, I think McCain just bothers you in general. But your not alone in that. He bothers me too. I just think there are bigger fish to fry with him like keeping him as far away as possible from the pretty big White House.
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@RFMaster08 (29)
•
13 Jul 08
Maybe he does like the Steelers, coming fron Arizona, I can tell yah as an NFL fan myself , being a steelers fan is a whole lot better than a Cardinal fan on "Any given Sunday"
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jul 08
I don't think it really matters what team he likes but which team's roster he recited back in Vietnam. Was it the Steelers as he said two days ago, was it the Packers as he put in his memoir and has said for years or did this even happen at all? Sorry if this seems to anyone like I'm "attacking" a hero's record, but it sure does make me wonder.
Annie
@RFMaster08 (29)
•
13 Jul 08
Do you remember everything you ever said. How insignificant. Who cares. This is really reaching now, grasping at anything. Pahleeze !
@anniepa (27955)
• United States
13 Jul 08
No, I don't remember "everything I ever said" but I was never a POW, I never wrote a best-selling book that was made into a movie and I'm not running for President.
Insignificant??? Who CARES??? Reaching and grasping??? Pahleeze indeed! You honestly don't think anyone cares that someone told a story for years and put it into a book about an alleged incident that took place while being interrogated as a POW in Vietnam, that when it told this story and put it in his book he named the players just as he claims he recited them to his captors and he said every time it was the Green Bay Packers, and indeed the names he repeated were names from that team but when in Pittsburgh suddenly it was the Steelers line-up that he recited? Now that's what he thinks of when he thinks of Pittsburgh?
Annie
