A few infos about planes flying over areas in war.
By topffer
@topffer (42155)
France
October 24, 2015 10:48am CST
After the crash of the MH17 flight shot by a missile over Ukraine, a friend started an interesting discussion where she blamed among others the FAA and IATA to not have taken measures to forbid flights over Ukraine.
I thought that it would be interesting to start a discussion to share a few things that I have found here :
- first, only the UN or a country can decide to create a "No Fly Zone" over a territory.
Organizations like FAA or Eurocontrol can only recommend to not fly over a particular area, which is not the same : a "No Fly Zone" means no plane at all, including military planes. By example, if there was a "No Fly Zone" over Syria actually, the only happy ones would be the ISIS fighters.
- second, a country can decide to forbid to SOME (or to ALL) commercial companies to fly over its territory or a part of it. Ukraine is an interesting example, as, starting from tomorrow, most Russian commercial companies will have not the right to fly over Ukraine, and Ukrainian companies over Russia.
- third, a company can decide to forbid to its planes to fly over an area at risk, and many had already done it for Eastern Ukraine before the crash of the MH17 flight.
- fourth, the only one in charge in a plane is the pilot ! Some planes are crossing risky zones with a flight plan... or without a flight plan, which is again international rules if you fly over several countries (I give a screen capture taken today of a Hawker 800XP over Ukraine flying from Malta to Moscow : it is a private jet which had not filed a flight plan before the take-off).
And finally I give you a link to a flight tracker. I centered it on Ukraine, as it is an interesting zone due to the ban of Russian companies tomorrow, but if you look at countries like Syria, Iraq or Afghanistan, you will be able to see what companies are taking the risk to fly over these countries. It can be an interesting information if you decide to take a plane to/from Asian destinations like Singapore or Mumbai.
Would you take a plane if you knew that it will fly over countries in war ?
Flightradar24 is the best live flight tracker that shows air traffic in real time. Best coverage and cool features!
21 people like this
25 responses
@purplealabaster (22085)
• United States
24 Oct 15
First, your link is working just fine.
Second, this gives me yet another reason to not set foot in a plane.
Third, can we tie @DaddyEvil up with duct tape and put him on one of these planes to test the safety before we try it ourselves?
I believe that we have a "no fly" zone over the White House. I am not sure who authorized it, but I am pretty sure that you risk being shot down if you do not abide by it.
Second, this gives me yet another reason to not set foot in a plane. Third, can we tie @DaddyEvil up with duct tape and put him on one of these planes to test the safety before we try it ourselves?
I believe that we have a "no fly" zone over the White House. I am not sure who authorized it, but I am pretty sure that you risk being shot down if you do not abide by it.7 people like this
@purplealabaster (22085)
• United States
24 Oct 15
@topffer I would not mind being on a private jet, especially if it did not leave the landing space. Do you mind if I bring my sister ( @TexanTornado ) with me?
Do you mind if I bring my sister ( @TexanTornado ) with me?5 people like this
@thesids (22180)
• Bhubaneswar, India
24 Oct 15
@purplealabaster Seems like @topffers flight will be a good time for all. I have offered only during the test flight before the deal is inked.
4 people like this
@topffer (42155)
• France
24 Oct 15
It was not working at first, I added a space before it, and here it is !
Like I said any country can decide to restrict the flights over a part of its territory, and it is certainly the case for the White House.
There is actually a plane in Eastern Ukraine going to Moscow, and I am following another private jet with no flight plan, an Embraer Legacy 600. The take-off was at Monaco this time, and it is running straight to Kiev. Isn't it nice to have a private jet to do some shopping in Monaco and be back at home for dinner ? There is 13 places in this one. If I had one I would invite my friends
.
.6 people like this
@purplealabaster (22085)
• United States
24 Oct 15
If you are important enough, then I would imagine that you would have more of a choice.
5 people like this
@vandana7 (102699)
• India
24 Oct 15
@purplealabaster ..well then let me correct it, if I was foolish enough..
3 people like this
@thesids (22180)
• Bhubaneswar, India
24 Oct 15
I will never fly - probably not in this life. I am scared of flying - be in planes, or anything else. Maybe I never got a chance but that is how it is at the moment.
Forgetting the fear, if I fly, I may never realize where they are flying (the route). That said, it is scary to fly over the places at war for sure.
As for the ill fated MH17, I have a hunch that it was intentionally destroyed.
5 people like this
@purplealabaster (22085)
• United States
24 Oct 15
I am afraid of flying, and I avoid doing it whenever possible. I have flown before when I couldn't avoid it, and I was fortunate that nothing happened. Mostly it was fine until we hit a spot with a lot of turbulence, and we had to put our seatbelts back on and it was quite scary.
4 people like this
@thesids (22180)
• Bhubaneswar, India
24 Oct 15
@topffer A private jet 
I can offer you some coffee and cakes to ensure a test ride (or flight) before you finalize that deal
Yes, the MH17 - no one claimed responsibility and that is why I doubt it. If any side would have claimed responsibility, probably the UN would get involved or even it might have had more severe complications. But as I said, it is just my hunch.
I will have a look at the link later in the night when the speed of Internet is a little better. Right now, it is too slow and it seems too long a wait.
I can offer you some coffee and cakes to ensure a test ride (or flight) before you finalize that deal
Yes, the MH17 - no one claimed responsibility and that is why I doubt it. If any side would have claimed responsibility, probably the UN would get involved or even it might have had more severe complications. But as I said, it is just my hunch.
I will have a look at the link later in the night when the speed of Internet is a little better. Right now, it is too slow and it seems too long a wait.4 people like this
@topffer (42155)
• France
24 Oct 15
You are like purple then, she is also scared to fly. Personally I like to sleep in my bed : I will have to consider to buy a private jet if I become a billionaire. If you watch the map linked, you will see that only a few planes are flying over areas in war, but the ones doing it are probably thinking that the risk is low... Saying that the MH17 has been intentionally destroyed is saying that a war crime has been committed by someone knowing what he was doing, and nobody has claimed to have voluntarily shot this plane.
. If you watch the map linked, you will see that only a few planes are flying over areas in war, but the ones doing it are probably thinking that the risk is low... Saying that the MH17 has been intentionally destroyed is saying that a war crime has been committed by someone knowing what he was doing, and nobody has claimed to have voluntarily shot this plane.2 people like this
@TexanTornado (5573)
• United States
24 Oct 15
Ok, you will have to excuse my ignorance, the places in which you name are all foreign to me, and I stink quite badly in geography. So I can't input much on all that.
However, to answer the question in which you posed, the answer would be, 'No'. I am not big on flying to start with, so I would never board a plane flying over a country that is in war.
4 people like this
@purplealabaster (22085)
• United States
24 Oct 15
LOL - the airplanes are literally foreign, sis!
4 people like this
@topffer (42155)
• France
24 Oct 15
The link to the map is centered around Ukraine, so you have not to find where it is. The problem is that most of the time you don't know if your plane will fly over an area in war or not. I noticed that a large number of companies are avoiding to fly in these areas, but not all of them.
. The problem is that most of the time you don't know if your plane will fly over an area in war or not. I noticed that a large number of companies are avoiding to fly in these areas, but not all of them.2 people like this
@topffer (42155)
• France
24 Oct 15
It is scary, but a bit different, I think. If you want to go to Damas or Bagdad today, you know that you are taking a real risk, but if you want to go to Mumbai, you don't always know if you will fly over Afghanistan (by the way, you see planes entering and living Afghanistan, but not flying over it : there is not even a radar to tell where a plane is exactly located...).
2 people like this
@UR_Forever_Raja (985)
• India
7 Nov 15
Hi,
I am new to mylot. I will try to question some facts.
First, So if a passenger plane by mistakenly get into no fly zone then there is no warnings ? Like we get on road 
Second - That will surely increase the cost of travel and so time of travel. This is not fair! 
Third - I didn't understood that point . Is that mean, own country saying fly over - no fly over zone at your own risk ? 
I am really amazed with the knowledge you have. Claps.
I never boarded a plane yet, But when I will go for it, I will surely going to check the route This will reduce people to fly to/from Asian countries. My family is in Asian country
Second - That will surely increase the cost of travel and so time of travel. This is not fair!
Third - I didn't understood that point . Is that mean, own country saying fly over - no fly over zone at your own risk ?
I am really amazed with the knowledge you have. Claps.
I never boarded a plane yet, But when I will go for it, I will surely going to check the route This will reduce people to fly to/from Asian countries. My family is in Asian country3 people like this
@topffer (42155)
• France
7 Nov 15
Welcome to myLot!
First, exchanging PMs with Mr @thesids we thought that you would create another account without no warning.
Second, was it really necessary to create another account to keep quite the same username Mr Raja 
? It will increase the time needed to reach your next payout, and it costs times.
Third, have you deleted the previous one ? If not, you can open it again and say "I am back"
. You would be back faster in India without having to fly over a zone in war.
!
First, exchanging PMs with Mr @thesids we thought that you would create another account without no warning.
Second, was it really necessary to create another account to keep quite the same username Mr Raja ? It will increase the time needed to reach your next payout, and it costs times.
Third, have you deleted the previous one ? If not, you can open it again and say "I am back". You would be back faster in India without having to fly over a zone in war.2 people like this
.
@much2say (57760)
• Los Angeles, California
25 Oct 15
I've only taken a plane twice in my life - when I was about 12. We went from here (Los Angeles) to San Francisco - and back. That's only city to city. Interestingly Hubby and I have not flown anywhere in our travels - and although we would have if we had had that opportunity, the thought of it scares me now. Although I may consider myself a risk taker, this would make me nervous - it would be a risk I have no control over once in the plane (except to choose not to take that route if I knew ahead of time we would be flying over certain war zones).
Although I may consider myself a risk taker, this would make me nervous - it would be a risk I have no control over once in the plane (except to choose not to take that route if I knew ahead of time we would be flying over certain war zones).1 person likes this
@much2say (57760)
• Los Angeles, California
25 Oct 15
@topffer I'm not sure, but I think I might have some issues flying on a plane - with or without having to go over a war zone. Just the thought that there is essentially nothing I can do if anything happened "up there" freaks me out a bit!
1 person likes this
@topffer (42155)
• France
25 Oct 15
I took planes often, but it was mainly small private planes for small travels. My longer travel in a "normal" plane was between Paris and Casablanca in Morocco, and it did not lasted long. It would also scare me to fly over a war zone. I am not sure that you can know the route that will take a plane...
. It would also scare me to fly over a war zone. I am not sure that you can know the route that will take a plane...1 person likes this
@arthurchappell (44941)
• Preston, England
26 Oct 15
impressive points - I guess the pilots and passengers of commercial jets won't know they have been fired at until the plane explodes as they won't have the warning systems, protections or manoeuvrability a fighter jet could employ
3 people like this
@topffer (42155)
• France
26 Oct 15
A pilot of a commercial jet does not ask to the passengers if they agree to take the risk of flying over an area in war. It is generally the company that decides, and I find unfair to not tell to the passengers : "The airline ticket is cheap, but you will fly over an area in war" to let them make their choice.
3 people like this
@Drosophila (16568)
• Ireland
31 Oct 15
I fly quite regularly, I don't really think it. If your number is up, it's up, there are worse ways to go than an airplane crash.
1 person likes this
@topffer (42155)
• France
31 Oct 15
@Drosophila Yup, as soon as we are born, we are old enough to die.
.1 person likes this
@Drosophila (16568)
• Ireland
31 Oct 15
@topffer Wow.. this convo went morbid soon enough.. anyways, on war-zones, it really depends, before that flight got shot done, I didn't think Ukraine was a problem. Same as I think flying over Turkey is probably fine too.. until FCO issued an advice against all travels within 10km of Syria boarder. The definition of "travel-safe" zones are changing.. so it's difficult to change things on the fly especially if you already got bookings.
1 person likes this
@crazyhorseladycx (39503)
• United States
24 Oct 15
i fear i don't fly..which's why i aint ne'er been outside'f u.s. soil. most interestin' data, gives me more reason not to get into'n aircraft.
1 person likes this
@topffer (42155)
• France
24 Oct 15
The flight map is interesting. We can see that, ever if there are recommendations to not flight over some countries, all companies/private jets owners do not follow them... but the map is also good to identify the companies that do not put their passengers at risk, and they are a large majority.
.1 person likes this
@crazyhorseladycx (39503)
• United States
24 Oct 15
@topffer i jest can't imagine payin' somebody to haul my 'hind up in the air o'er such?? i wonder if'n folks e'en pay much mind to such?
1 person likes this
@crazyhorseladycx (39503)
• United States
24 Oct 15
@topffer i jest can't imagine anybody with regards to human life puttin' 'em in any sorta peril. i reckon that greed takes o'er....those shattered life's can't be put to right...
1 person likes this
@blitzfrick (2890)
• United States
31 Oct 15
In answer to your question, no. But some people must because of their work. A couple of friends of mine took a vacation in the Middle East a few years back. I marvel at their audacity, or foolishness, whichever it was that caused them to ignore the volatility of the region at that time.
1 person likes this
@topffer (42155)
• France
31 Oct 15
@blitzfrick I would not have been in Syria in 2011
. They were a bit unconscious.
. They were a bit unconscious.1 person likes this
@topffer (42155)
• France
31 Oct 15
I would not spend my holidays there actually, but Middle East was quite safe 10 years ago, and I have several friends who visited Syria without any problem. People going there for their work know that they are taking a risk, not always the passengers of planes flying there...
1 person likes this
@blitzfrick (2890)
• United States
31 Oct 15
@topffer Yes, I know it was peaceful 10 years ago, but my friends visited there in 2011. Not sure it was so peaceful then. They made a safe trip though. I'd have been too nervous to enjoy such a trip.
1 person likes this
@nanette64 (20363)
• Fairfield, Texas
25 Oct 15
I don't like flying period @toppfer , but you can bet your booties I wouldn't be flying over any area where a war is going on.
3 people like this
@marguicha (230365)
• Chile
29 Oct 15
It is a pity that many people cannor choose not to take a plane to some places. I would not take a plane (or go) to a country in war. It doesn´t happen like that with working people
1 person likes this
@marguicha (230365)
• Chile
29 Oct 15
@topffer I like to go for vacations at the Caribbean. For some time I kept away from the best climate in the world because I was afraid of the Bermuda triangle
@topffer (42155)
• France
29 Oct 15
@marguicha There is perhaps something true about the Bermuda triangle
. Personally, I am afraid about traveling on Friday the 13th. I will start soon a discussion about this as there will be a Friday the 13th next month.
. Personally, I am afraid about traveling on Friday the 13th. I will start soon a discussion about this as there will be a Friday the 13th next month.
@Letranknight2015 (52665)
• Philippines
7 Jan 16
I've never experience flying before and if i did i may already know the rules on which areas you should fly or not. anyways, only pilots should recognized these rules.
1 person likes this
@topffer (42155)
• France
26 Oct 15
The main risk for you actually would be Afghanistan, if you were traveling to Europe. If you intend to do it in the future the flight radar map can be useful to tell what companies are flying over Afghanistan, and what companies are not doing it.
.1 person likes this
@DaddyEvil (174797)
• United States
19 Nov 15
Well, Top, apparently, I was not given a choice in whether I get on the plane flying over a country that is engaged in a war!
I guess I have you to thank for that!
Since you allowed @purplealabaster to bring me aboard your private jet while I was duct taped all up, I think the least you could do is fund my shopping spree and cover any/all bets I make in the casino at Monaco, as well as telling your pilot to fly the heck around the air space of the country that is waging a war when we fly home again! (I am trying to be fair here, you know!)
I guess I have you to thank for that!
Since you allowed @purplealabaster to bring me aboard your private jet while I was duct taped all up, I think the least you could do is fund my shopping spree and cover any/all bets I make in the casino at Monaco, as well as telling your pilot to fly the heck around the air space of the country that is waging a war when we fly home again! (I am trying to be fair here, you know!)1 person likes this
@JamesHxstatic (29410)
• Eugene, Oregon
10 Jan 16
Definitely not. I caught a miserable cold on a domestic flight last week and have no desire to catch a missile or wave at a fighter pilot.
1 person likes this
@Pattitude (1286)
• Newton, North Carolina
8 Nov 15
Very interesting points that you have brought up! I definitely would not fly in a plane that was going over a war zone.
1 person likes this
