Obama & the Dem's Carbon cap & trade will double your electric bill !!!!!!!!!

@ladyluna (7004)
United States
June 30, 2008 12:34pm CST
Hello All, Over the weekend I, and approximately 300 other folks, attended a regional energy meeting. The keynote speaker was the C.O.O. of Tri-State, which is an energy generator who sells their power to electric cooperatives throughout out Colorado, and NM. I asked the C.O.O. if Tri-State had run the numbers based on the current cap & trade 'Global Warming Tax' proposals, and how it WILL (not might) affect the individual home energy customer. His response: "Based on the current proposals, the additional tax and 'clean air permitting costs will slightly more than double the consumer's current monthly electric bill." I then asked him about the difficulties associated with incorporating alternatively generated energy into the same platform with consistently generated 'clean coal', hydro-electric, and nuclear generated electricity. His response: "I'm sure you've seen power transfer stations, right? Well, one of our greatest challenges as an energy wholesaler is to maintain a consistent current running through your power lines. Too much is a 'surge', and can destroy your electrical appliances. Too little leads to 'brown outs'. So, we have to maintain a steady flow of power. It's impossible to do that with wind and solar, because they are not produced with consistentcy. When the wind stops blowing, and when the sun goes down, the energy falls off. Which means that we need to re-adjust the power from other sources to make up for the lost flow. We also cannot 'hold back' surges in wind & solar generation, because there is no way to store that kind of energy. So, essentially, the legislative mandates that we purchase 30% alternatively generated electricity means that you are spending your hard-earned money on nothing. Because, we cannot rely on being able to use what we are required to purchase, unless and until a viable battery, or other type of storage medium is invented. So, in other words, we're required to charge you more money for wind & solar, yet we can't use it -- so we end up having to purchase double the amount from clean coal, hydro, & nuclear, to be able to provide you constant power, so that when you turn your light switch on -- your room lights up." I have mentioned this on MyLot many times. Though, I believe it is worthy of reiteration: According to Sandia National Labs, a preeminent energy storage R&D laboratory, we are fully 25-30 years away from being able to efficiently store wind & solar generated electricity for even 24 hours. _____________________________________________________ [b]So, are you going to be happy if the Dem's pass this Global Warming bill? You'll be looking at, at least, double your current electricity bill? If you pay $100 per month now, you'll be paying at least $200 after Senator Obama & Mdm. Pelosi get done hosing you. Of course, the gasoline prices will be similarly effected, as will the cost of food, clothing, necessities, -- everything that gets to a store shelf via tractor trailer, or diesel train. What do you think about the state & federal governments mandating the purchase of solar & wind, when we cannot yet use it efficiently? Isn't this putting the cart before the horse? Oh, and by the way -- I'm a HUGE proponent of alternative energy! I walk the talk with solar hot water collection for hot water and hot water heating. So, I'm not some coal, oil, or nuke flunkie. I'm just trying to keep my electric bills down, while we let Science do it's part to get us on a more wholistic track. [/b] Think long and hard about how your vote this November will personally effect your life and wallet. If all these costs go through the roof, and your paycheck stays the same, what will you do???
2 people like this
5 responses
• United States
30 Jun 08
Now, you know why so many power companies are supporting the man made global warming scam. I kid you not. I have seen power company commericals informing the public of all they are going to do to fight global warming. They left out the part about it doubling our power costs. What will I do? I will install my own solar hot water device along with converting my refrigerator to running on a bank of batteries charged by solar and wind. I'd rather pay more for my alternative energy than be ripped off.
2 people like this
• United States
30 Jun 08
The thing all people should remember is that Enron was one of the biggest backers of this whole man made global scam and the trading of carbon credits. I know I've mentioned it before, but hopefully someone new will see it.
2 people like this
@ladyluna (7004)
• United States
1 Jul 08
Excellent point, Red!
@Destiny007 (5805)
• United States
1 Jul 08
There you have it... someone who tells it like it is, and gives a real world explanation to help illustrate his point. Carbon trading and cap and trade schemes solve nothing except ensure that the people who own the companies that deal those things get rich at everyone else's expense. If these things do pass, a lot of people are going to have to learn to live without electricity. It is just that simple.
2 people like this
@ladyluna (7004)
• United States
1 Jul 08
Hello Destiny, Yes, Tri-State's C.O.O. was indeed a breath of fresh air -- despite the fact that he was giving us bad news! Hopefully, reason will prevail, and we'll be able to get the 'naysayers' out of the way before we end up having to learn to live without energy. We in the USA have not had to really 'do without' anything in 3/4 of a century. I suspect that that's a transition that we won't adapt to very well!
@gewcew23 (8007)
• United States
1 Jul 08
When reading this you will get two different responses; First response is from people like me. I see the problem with these attempt to force everyone to become green. The second response is from people who have their head up their butts. The first thing they see is you talked to a person from those evil power companies. Yeah evil until you do not have any electricity for your TV. Look folk unless you have solar planels all over their house, you need electricity. If you use more expensive fuel to generate electricity, the price of electricity will go up, not that hard to understand folks. I love the part about not being able to store electricity from wind, and then creating surges. Start sockpilling up on surge protecters that is all I can say about that. Let us not forget about the fact that manufacturing will go up. Everything is made by using electricity to make it. If these manufactures have to pay more for electricity then they will pass the price to who, you guess?
1 person likes this
@ladyluna (7004)
• United States
1 Jul 08
Hello Gewcew, Precisely!!! Thank you for adding the very relevant point that virtually everything manufactured relies on energy to get the raw materials to a finished product, then to market. If we had the ability to use alternatives efficiently, I would dig my heels in to expand the economic and energy market with a new alternatives industry. However, we are not yet there. And, according to Sandia Labs, we won't be for another two to three decades. Before any government institutes these kinds of alternatives mandates, WE MUST HAVE THE ABILITY TO USE THAT ENERGY EFFICIENTLY! Otherwise, we're throwing good money after bad! To provide a base comparison, our solar hot water only works at about a 25% - 30% efficiency. It works in our limited capacity because we live in the desert Southwest, where the sun shines more than 300 days out of the year. During times of inclement weather, we have to rely on the power grid, because the energy from solar collection dissipates very rapidly without storage (imagine how quickly a bowl of boiling hot water settles out to room temperature when the heat source is removed). What's more, the photovoltaics scenario is that much worse than solar hot water generation (I know because I lived with photovoltaics for a year -- grrrr!). This of course, is the reason why John McCain has issued the $300 million dollar challenge to anyone who can create a more efficient battery or energy storage system!
1 person likes this
@arkaf61 (10881)
• Canada
30 Jun 08
Very well put and, of course I"m 100% with you. I'm all for alternative sources of energy,but if it's not viable yet what will we be paying for? Probably what extra they charge in our electrical bills won't even be put on research to make it viable!
@ladyluna (7004)
• United States
30 Jun 08
Hello Arkaf, How is your son? I've been hoping you would stop by to let us know how he's doing. In reply to your response: You make a very relevant point. I cannot speak to how Canada is responding to Global Warming threats. However, as the US Congress is proposing it, the profits from the tax will be spent in all manner of wasteful nonsense. Only a small percentage will be granted back to R&D to focus on improved efficiency. To date, the most formulated U.S. cap & trade "Global Warming" legislation is most certainly Lieberman-Warner. You can read the highlights of that rotten,shell-game legislation at the link below. http://www.hillheat.com/articles/2007/08/02/lieberman-warner-plan-unveiled
1 person likes this
@Wolfechu (1193)
• United States
30 Jun 08
I'm very surprised to see a major corporation taking an anti-democratic party stance. You don't see that very often.
@ladyluna (7004)
• United States
30 Jun 08
Hello Wolfechu, I'm not sure where you are going with your observation, though to be sure, this had nothing to do with any candidate, or party endorsement. It had everything to do with a regional co-op energy producer trying to keep it's costs down, so that they can help us keep our costs down.
@Wolfechu (1193)
• United States
30 Jun 08
Perhaps I'm misinterpreting how the US energy market works. In the UK, there's perhaps 5 companies nationally, none of which would be considered anything other than major corporations.
1 person likes this
@ladyluna (7004)
• United States
30 Jun 08
Hello Wolfechu, I believe that you have much company in that regard. I doubt that most Americans understand our own energy system! To briefly explain: In the USA, anyone who wants to invest in energy generation can apply for all the necessary business permits, and begin generating energy. They need to set up contracts to sell that energy to 'someone', and then they can call themselves an energy wholsaler. This is the heart of the 'free market' system. The many competitors keep the price down by way of that competition. In the USA, we have many, many privately, and publicly traded small, medium, and large energy producers. Some are a niche, who only sell their power to co-ops, or organizations owned by the members. Tri-State is one such co-op wholesaler. I am a member-owner of an energy co-op -- hence the reason why I was at the regional meeting. Does that make sense? It sounds like UK energy is being produced by a limited number of producers. Is that accurate? And, are they privately owned? Or State operations?