Health insurance and illegal immigration  

We can't afford to keep them. It would be cheaper in the long run to deport them...than pay for them for the rest of their lives.

I agree, and that is just enforcing the laws already there. There are multiple legal ways for somebody to come to the country. The cost of illegals cripples us. Now they want to give social security benefits to them. Now tell me how that works, illegals do not even pay into this.

Oh I know they work...but the jobs they do are not good paying ones. Even if they get legal status the jobs they get won't pay much. All those taxes taken out of their pay checks...well they will get it back at the end of the year. A nice tax refund check. They won't make enough to qualify to pay taxes. You know like when I was college..I worked part time..I did not make enough to qualify to have to pay federal or state taxes...but payroll taxes were still taken out in my paycheck..I got a tax refund from both the state and feds for what was taken out of my paychecks. They will too.
They will be taking out of the system ALOT more than they will ever pay in.

I am all for immigration. But only if it is done legally. Not illegals who come here. then demand to given status even though they did not follow our laws and rules when they came in the first place.

Lil, do you realize what illegal immigrants have done to the construction/home improvement industry? My son was a drywall finisher for over 20 years. He made $24 an hour. Little by little the contractors and subcontractors started using illegal day laborers who they paid less than half of what my son was earning and they didn't have to keep them on the books or the insurance. Among the changes that need to be made is for there to be stiff penalties for anyone who hires day laborers like this. If employers were forced to pay these people a fair wage they would be earning a decent living. The painters that worked on the jobs with my son made something like $20 an hour, by the way.

They hurt a lot of Americans in my area too. taking jobs they did want and needed.
There is a gas station in my town they all hang out at. The construstion foremen go and pick up the day labors they want. Pay them under the table.
People can say "they only do job that american don't want"...all they want but it is not true.
Here in my town and most towns I know they just about kicked amricans out of the construction business.
There was a BIG flap after Katrina hit. The fed pushed money into the city to rebuild the city...the illegals flooded in. Alot of Americans in the construction business went to New Orleans thinking they could get work....it went to the illegals instead. So our federal tax dollars to rebuild new orleans put illegals to work..not americans. The news covered it some at the time. But not as much as they should have.
they have hurt americans. They have hurt our economy. I don't think we should reward them with citizenship.

YOu are right. Employers that hire illegals...they should loose their business license permenantly and face fines.

I've been screaming for crackdowns on employers here in Florida, too. The contractors would be so easy to catch...parking lots could be staked out. U.S. Sugar just killed me with the games they played with the temp. harvest crews. If a number came back as wrong they just called the employee into HR and asked for another one...again...and again...until the harvest was over. Now the harvest is contracted out so no one checks anything.

We're ALL in agreement about cracking down on the employers who hire illegals and pay them slave wages under the table. That's the first thing that needs to be done but they continue to get away with it. They're the ones who should be treated like the criminals they are because the immigrants are often uneducated and they just want a better life for their families. I know what they're doing is illegal if they're here illegally, I'm not condoning anyone breaking the law, but I'm just saying in their case it's not as serious an offense or as blatant a crime as the employers who are breaking several laws. They're hiring illegals, they're paying below the minimum wage and they're not paying taxes or withholding taxes from their workers. I say THREE strikes and you're out!

Annie

Oh I think we should crack down on the employers of illegals BIG TIME. Also people who rent homes to them...cut them off from getting ANY social programs.etc...
We won't have to deport them....if they can't find work, a place to live or actual find a way to survive or have a life here...they will leave. They will deport themselves.
Saves us a TON on of money. We don't have to deport them or pay for benefits for them.

You do realize that you're talking about over 11 million people, right? Do you have any idea what that would cost this country? What about the children who were born in this country and are citizens? What should be done about them...and their parents?

They should be treated humanely...but still deported.

spalladino- yes I know how many people we are talking about. I still want them deported. As for the children they have here...well that is simple. Same as we do now. The parents who are illegal get a choice..take the kids with you...or leave them here with family or friends that are here legally.
The kids won't loose their american status. They can come back anytime they want or they can stay in the country.

I don't feel sorry for them. Their parents put themselves and their kids in that situation. They knew what would happen if they came here illegally and got caught. The parents decided it was worth the risk. Be mad at the parents for breaking the law...not us for enforcing it. We did not cause this mess...the parents did.

It is no different than a friend of mine. She is from france. She is legally here. She had her daughter here. She plans to return to france soon. Her daughter is still a US citizen because she was born here. But she is going back to france (which she is also a citizen of) with her mom when she returns All those kids of those illegals are also citizens of the country their parents are legal citizens of. So they are just returning to a country they are already citizens of if they parents decide to take them with them.

spalladino and lilwonders456

Illegals are Illegals they have no right to be there, as for the Children that's the fault of the parent not the Country, Just another slimy way to enter a Country.

Use the Children as a bargain tool how gutless of them , Fault is on the Parents they should have thought, being Illegal when caught they will be deported, Children go with them.

There is a correct way to enter a Country and they know that also.

11 million what will be the cost to keep them far greater than to deport the Illegals, They are Criminals.

If you jump the fence at the Football and don't pay, they kick you out.
You sneak into the theatre without a ticket and are caught , you get kicked out.

Same goes for those who sneak into a Country, You get Kicked out, Whats so hard to understand about that.


HICCUP/

This is my problem when it comes to children, hiccup. If a child is born here, that child is an American citizen who is entitled to all of the rights and protections that every other American citizen has. There are no second class citizens...those with only some rights. While I do agree that their parents broke the law when they came here, the children did not and are legal citizens of this country. You cannot kick legal citizens who have done nothing wrong out of the country no matter how much you might want to.

spalladino

This is a matter that the USA has to sort out,
One one hand people complain re what the Health Bill cost and in the second breath they complain that Illegals are costing so much with these and other service given to them.

One would think that the First Illegal act would nil any other rights even having Children in a Country they are not legal to be in the first place.

Sure one can say the Children have done no wrong, but it was an Illegal act for their parents to be there in the first place.

But Like I said this is up to the USA to sort out.
You cant have the cake and eat it at the same time.

Answer is Children stay Parents go, harsh as it may sound, but something needs to be done to stop Illegals entering a Country.

HICCUP/

Yes, something would have to be worked out because you can't make the citizenship of someone who was born here null and void. There is nothing in the Constitution that allows for that. Also, no one in this country is punished for the acts of their parents. I agree with the children stay/parents go idea but that would also be hard to work out. Our foster care system is already stretched too thin and the last thing we want in this country is to go back to having children warehoused in orphanages...especially millions of them from one specific group.

Why give amnesty again? When Reagan did it there were 2 million. that amnesty encouraged more to come. Now if we give amnesty again...they will flood our borders worse than they already are. Giving amnesty a second time will really show them we won't enforce our law. Plus we will hear from every illegal after that..."well you did it twice already...you gave those people amnesty...why not us", "why can't I get amnesty, you gave it to them". they all will espect amnesty if we do it again for the rest of time. They will basically feel if they make over the border we owe them citizenship.
Yes we should have enforce our laws and secured our borders. shame on Reagan, Bush Sr, Clinton, Bush jr. and Obama for not doing it.
The time to do it is now. Show them we mean it. We will enforce our laws. That they have to respect our borders and our laws.

I already answered about the kids in post farther up.

Well with the unemployement rate in this country I would say ALOT of americans would go for those jobs.
Also they do take job american do want really bad...like construction jobs that usully pay really well...until the illegals took it over.

Also once we give them citizenship...all those employers are not going to be able to pay them less than minium wage anymore...so I wonder how many of those companies will lay them off instead of paying higher wages and benefits?

you are not serious are you?
this country is in bad shape...we can't afford to pay anymore in taxes to support them. YOu do realize that things are BAD in this country right now. Tons of people out of work. Tons of people loosing their homes? How are they going to pay taxes?

They don't, because they don't have any income?

You don't get taxed if you can't afford it. That's the whole point.

I'd say people's lives are more important than your new 52" HDTV.

It's a 65" actually.

I have to admit, that made me chuckle a little <__<

Are you kidding me. YOu know why soooo many illegals come here? because this country has some of the easiest laws. The rest of the world is very hard on illegal immigration...and it is harder to legally immigrate to those countries.
France, England, Germany, Russia, heck even Mexico has really tough laws to immigrate to their countries...and if you get caught illegally being in their country...they don't play. YOU WILL BE KICKED OUT AND FAST.
So why is it that the rest of the world is allowed to have tough immigration laws and enforce them...but we are not? that is a double standard.

And for someone that is from a "dangerous" country and in fear for their lives...there is a special process just for them that is pretty fast to allow them to come to this country and be here legally.

The US is one of the most conservative developed countries in the world. Take a look at our (Sweden's) immigration policy. We let just about anyone in, and easily, just the way it should be.

If there really was such a convenient, fast way to get citizenship, the US wouldn't have so many illegal immigrants. Sweden has next to none as far as I'm aware.

The only way immigration is "fast" and "easy" is if you file the paper work in our state seeking "asylum"...because your fear for your life in your own country.

The government looks at your case and then decides if you can stay. that way it is not abused.

The other ways to come here legally are not so easy. YOu have to ask permission to come here...go through a background check...take citizenship classes...learn the language...then you can be a US citizen.

Each country has right to make and enforce their own laws. Tell you what...sence your country likes to take anyone...why don't we send all our illegals to you.
Then you can make them legal..they can be citizens of your country and you guys can pay to take care of them...everyone would be happy then and the problem would be solved.

Just so you France and Mexico both has worse immigration policies than we do. We will let anyone apply for citizenship...France will not let anyone who is over a certain age apply...because they will be taking more out of their state government programs than they would be paying in. They are not letter older people immigrate into the country anymore.
England...sence all the terror attacks they have had...big time crack down on immigration...heck they are revoking people's citizenships who legally immigrated to the country and deporting them. Not a good time to be Muslim and try to immigrate to England.

We're a small country, we can't take too many. The US, on the other hand, is a big country and should be able to take quite a lot of immigrants without a problem.

Of course every country has the right make and enforce their own laws, but that doesn't mean those laws are fair. This is 2010, not 1932. You have to think of the whole world, not just your own country.

The things you're saying about England and France are all lies. Look up their immigration policy and you'll see nothing like it. The European Union wouldn't allow such BS.

First of all, welcome to mylot Yuusha.

Now that I've made nice, let me explain a few things to you about the problem the U.S. is having with illegal immigration. Unlike legal immigration, those who sneak into our country are a mystery to us. We don't know who they are, whether they are criminals or not. We can't assist them in becoming productive, contributing members of our society because they live their lives hidden in the shadows. I'm sure your country would not want criminals sneaking in in large numbers. Well, we don't either. Gang activity and the crime that goes along with it has increased drastically in the boarder states so what does that tell you? In addition, because these people live in the shadows and cannot earn a living by legitimate means, they resort to other tactics...tactics that hurt Americans. Long gone are the days when the illegal immigrant only picked fruit off the trees or from the fields. They have invaded many occupations that Americans once earned a decent living in...construction, home improvement, landscaping, jobs in the service industry. The playing field took a decidedly uneven lean because these people were willing and able to work for less than half the price of an American citizen and their employer didn't have to pay employment takes or offer benefits. This has hurt millions of Americans.

Yes, the U.S. is a big country and we already take quite a lot of immigrants...legally. Immigrants who play by the rules, who we know who they are, who pay taxes along with the rest of us. Those who don't play by the rules should not be welcome in any country because they don't contribute to the greater good of that country. Would you really like a million or so like this living in your country?

Yes, why not treat everyone equally, beth? We have legal immigration in this country so either everyone should use that route or no one should use it...which do you think is the best for the country? BTW, the stereotype that all native Americans are living in poverty is not true. The Seminole Tribe of Florida, for instance, are living very well...better than many of the rest of us as a matter of fact.