Do people become Atheists because they are Hurt????

Thanks for the nice comments. I sometimes come across judgemental???? I must admit that english and language might be my weaker talent. I must strive to be more precise. I guess I can be hard on some religious views and ideas. However, truth doesn't always feel good. Thanks for the feedback as well!

no, some people's idea of their god is of a very judgemental type. you know that i have different beliefs to you but i don't want to get into any kind of argument. (i've just been in politics btw and apart from anything else i'm exhausted)

Never to argue but to interact my good friend. Thanks for all your comments!! Any feedback no matter how it comes out is welcome. In this world we all learn from each other. If people avoid interaction, they avoid learning as well. Let me have it!! I am one who doesn't get angry no matter what you say. If I ever sound angry in my words, let me know.It is never intended. I will explain it all. Thanks!!

that is a very good discussion. i appreciate you for being honest. like other people who pretend to act like a saint but inside they think more like a devil. a wolf in sheep clothing..:D

Thanks for those nice comments Flower. Yes. truth is what is important. Sometimes that just takes all of us together.

Ah yes. my good friend island7. What stops you from searching for God??? Does the ideas of authority bother you? How can you be so sure that God does not exist when you don't even search for God? God is as real as I am. Do I even remotely sound delusional??? You will find that God will not think like us and God can come up with ideas that we could never think of. I am not delusional when I talk with you. I am not delusional when I talk with God. When a person thinks they have all the answers, the reality is that they just quit looking. Knowledge opens doors just to find more questions. Be brave. It will just be between you and God. See what happens. God is anything but impersonal. God has set all the parameters of your life. He has set the stage. It's your turn to act! so Choose!

No-one knows all the answers. However, it is knowlwsge to know what is not the answer as i do.

Fair enough. How can you know that it is not the answer?? Example: at one time scientists knew that the smallest part that an element could be divided was an atom. They knew this!!!! Is that so today?????? They have changed what they know! More knowledge supplied a different view. I realize that you have years of understanding where you are now. In search for knowledge, there is always more. Do you search for more?????? As always, thanks for your comments!!

I am always searching for deeper answers as is the scientist. My knowledge tells me that this deeper knowing will only come with time, as it should be. Spirituality is a step beyond religion as it is only a part of it.

I have to agree with you here. Time will reveal all the answers. If you search as a scientist, I know that you are walking toward God. Thanks for all your comments!!

Where is this anger and hurt leading you???? Happy???? Doesn't sound so. You think I have religion driven arrogance?? Perhaps you read me wrong. I could not believe in any religion probably for much of the same reasons as you. Simply because you can't believe in religion, doesn't mean that God does not exist! Are you allowing the actions of others along with your hurt to direct your path? We are meant to think our way through life not to just feel our way through life. Life is about learning and growing as people. We learn through the parameters of our life and the people we meet. We are all meant to interact. You will always be welcome to comment here. I do like truth. It will sometimes shake people up but it has to be out there. I do not want followers. I want people to take their own path to God. Just like God gives you total freedom of choice, I am no more than something you can choose to think about. I will never beat on your door but I might shine a light in your window. Thanks for all your comments. This is not meant to hurt just to make you think!!

Now you have the gall to tell me I should think. Go away and play with your toys, child, and leave the adults in peace.

Lash

OK! I understand you! Thanks for your comments!

I agree with Grandpa, atheists are that because religion and scripture don't make believable sense, and that is something I can understand and respect. I am a Christian and I would never in a million years say half the things Bird just said. Lash, I respect your choices and way of thinking. Alot of people who CLAIM to have religion don't seem to be as tolerant of diversity in the sense of how people think and why they think the things they do the way those without a religion. Lash you seem more tolerant of people than say Bird. I'm sorry there are people out there who will try and tell you what you should feel and think.

Welcome Rmuxagirl. There is no hate in my heart for anyone. Life is about learning and growing as people. We learn through the parameters of our life and the people we interact with. I love everyone. I will interact with everyone. Diversity of all the different views is where truth is. Sometimes truth can step on a few toes. I love you enough to put up with any drama that comes from this. All your comments and those of everyone are very welcome. Thanks!!

It was Marx who pulled the line that religion is the opium of the mass. I think he has a point in it, but I also disagree with him as he generalised... I think his own Marxism became the opium of the mass, so to speak, in Soviet Union. No wonder Soviet collapsed because Marxism could not sustain it.

Thanks for the comments Headhunter. God gives everyone their freedom. I know societies need laws so people can live together but when freedom is taken from people, the power of diversity is lost. Fewer open ideas means weaker economies, weaker discoveries in science and knowledge, and even weaker in spirit and life of the people and nation. People who control, prevent the potential of what really can be. More open views mean a larger overall view than any one person can have. Yes, the soviet union has learned a lesson. The world learned along with them. Who could ever have thought you would see a stock market in China. Does that make China Capitalists???? Maybe?? Partly???? We all influence each other. Sometimes even the smallest thing can make a big difference. Thanks again for your comments!!

Headhunter, most politically educated people would challenge the idea that Russian communism ever had much to do with Marxism, certainly not from the time of Stalin.

Lash

Then with all your reason and logic, you can not come up with even the possibility that a higher intelligence created all this??? Are you sure you aren't basing your logic on the fact that other's beliefs do not add up?? Hasn't religion hurt you?? Isn't it no more than EGO that tells man that he is the smartest being in the universe??? Now, if you concede the fact that a higher intelligent being is possible then shouldn't you be searching for the truth??? Is truth important to you??? If God exists, logic dictates that He can be found. Do you search??? Sometimes people who search find what they are searching for.

"Then with all your reason and logic, you can not come up with even the possibility that a higher intelligence created all this???"

I can find no compelling reason or evidence to support the conclusion that some higher intelligence exists, let alone created anything.

"Are you sure you aren't basing your logic on the fact that other's beliefs do not add up?"

No, I am applying my logic to the facts at hand. The beliefs of others do not enter into the equation although I will concede that some beliefs of others do seem a bit silly to me.

"Hasn't religion hurt you??"

No it hasn't really had either a negative or positive effect on my life.

"Isn't it no more than EGO that tells man that he is the smartest being in the universe???"

The human species may not even be the smartest species on this planet, let alone in the universe. If intelligence can be judged by the complexity of language and communicative skills than the Humpback Whale has us beat.

"Now, if you concede the fact that a higher intelligent being is possible then shouldn't you be searching for the truth??? Is truth important to you???"

While a being of higher intelligence is a real possibility it is a logical fallacy to conclude that that being is a god or had any thing to do with creation. That higher intelligence could be a Humpback Whale or a messenger from the planet Zolton.

The truth is important to me but the real truth is that there is no universal truth, only the truth you observe from your own unique viewpoint.

Goods answers. Why is it a logical fallacy that a higher being did create it all???? I find just the opposite. Look at the complexity of this world. Things fit together pretty well. Look at DNA. Lots of genius behind that. Even Evolution reveals very high intelligence to design a system that runs on it's own. Man lacks so much knowledge. This leads to a very narrow view. God's handy work is all around you. All the secrets of the universe stare us in the face. What can you really see???? Surely you can't say it's logical that random chance created it all. My chevy truck did not make itself. If it did, I wish it would make me a new model. The old one is getting run down. Thanks for those comments!!

Thanks for all your kind words. Everybody does have a differnt view. By giving everyone a different view, God gives us a larger view than any one person can have. Truth and knowledge comes from the free interaction of all. Lots of what I have discovered comes from such interactions. All truth no matter the source must be questioned. Real truth never changes. Some people can be hurt when they discover they weren't holding the truth but haven't we all held false beliefs in the past?? It is a part of learning if only we do not allow our egos to get in the way. Thanks again for the nice comments!!

God is not looking for you to accept Him. In fact, believing has never been important to God. All knowledge and the secrets of the universe stare us in the face. Who can see? How long did man watch birds fly before he figured out how??? You say that God condones hate???? Does He really?? Shouldn't God's children have free choice,free will. The only people who hate are those who do not understand what it is. God will send lessons. Sure we all must witness hate. Some of us fight to show people what hate does. For the rest it is a reminder of what the real answers are. You need proof of God? If God really exists, then He can be found. God doesn't just give us all the answers. Wisdom is gained from the struggle to acquire knowledge. You want proof of God then you should search. Sometimes people who search find what they search for. God can be found. Perhaps, it's all just a test of intelligence. Thanks for all your comments!!!

Everything you said leads to the same thing, though. Where is the concrete proof? Not the "faith" or "belief."

The only concrete proof you will accept, is when you make contact with God. Alas, the journey must be taken by you! The decision to make this journey must be yours. It's not what everybody else does that counts. It's what you do! I can merely point. Like God, I am putting truth out there. What you do with the truth is entirely up to you. I wish you the very best!!

I am not sure how to reply to your logic as it is clearly just another attempt by a follower to cover up the lack of evidence that God exists.
It is fine to believe in god, your beliefs are your own. As such, my beliefs are mine and it will take much more than the empty promise that proof will come to convert me. I am not, by any means, attacking your belief, rather I am pointing out that which I do not understand.

You simply do not understand me. I am not a follower. I follow no one. I belong to no religion. I am not trying to convert anyone. I have been supplying truth. Be who you must! It's a part of God's plan. God has set the parameters of your life but all the choices are yours. Believe as you will but never quit searching for the facts because beliefs are not always true. This too is your choice. God will love you unconditionally no matter what you choose. Me, I'm just putting a bit of truth out there. You know it has to be out there if people want to discover it. God wants all His children to be able to stand on their own two feet. Can one really do that by just following???? I don't mean to confuse you. Perhaps God is starting to rub off on me. Few understand Him as well. Just like all the physics of this world add up, so does the people factor. God is very very smart. He is complex. Can simple answers really tell it all??

"It's part of god's plan."
"God wants all of his children to stand on their own two feet."
"Perhaps god is starting to rub off on me. Few understand him as well."

Since you're apparently such a close personal friend of god's, perhaps you can ask him a few questions...


This is just ridiculous. You claim to KNOW GOD'S MIND.

READ what you posted. Do you REALLY claim to know god's mind? How can you make such an outrageous claim?

Matsulori, you just summed up the reason I never replied another time. I feel that a conversation like this can only go around in ridiculous circles. Not only can religious people not produce proof of God, but they make claims about knowing what he wants!! Thanks for the input!

Say you meet a new friend. Every moment you have contact with this friend will change you even if it is a little. God is changing and influencing me alot. Part of what I say, is what is going on with God. All this wasn't just handed to me but lots have been confirmed. Indeed, question what I say. I want you to question everything in this world. I do!! Doesn't any of it have a ring of truth to it??? Curiosity????? For a person must want to find truth, hunger for answers, be open to reality. THE JOURNEY IS YOURS!!!!!!All the choices are yours!!! I'm just pointing!! Question is: What do you really want?????

The only problem with your prescription is that, since atheists by definition don't believe in your ONE, they are hardly going to listen to anything you have to say about him. Your "truth" is not their "truth", and definitely not my "truth". The arrogance of religious believers in forever assuming there is only one truth and that they have it, especially when that truth differs even between different brands of the same religion let alone from other religions, never ceases to amaze me.

Lash

I have to agree a bit here with grandpa. Lots of religious people are convinced they have the truth thereby they stop questioning. Truth must always be questioned, even long held beliefs. Real truth will never change. Of course, not believing that God exists should be questioned as well!! Simply because an army of religions want you to follow them, doesn't mean any are right or that God is what they say He is. I think God and science are alike in that both must always add up. If they don't then it's not truth. Now as far as Mr Ford says that people who are out to have a good time become atheists because religion goes against their good time,I think most people are a bit deeper than that. For the person who really concentrates on that good time, they aren't even considering religion at all much less whether God exists. They just think of the next party. Lots of great comments here!!!! Thanks everyone!!

Now you are never going to get me to stop thinking!! Don't you know?? Knowledge solves all the problems. As far as being eternal, I know it is hard to understand for everything in this physical world is stuck in linear time. There is so much yet to learn. So you want me to walk you to God's door. I did that one time with a friend. My friend was just confused. God has a very high IQ. Added to that people see only what they want to see, further people make God to what they think He should be and will not accept reality. People are controlling and want to wrap God around their finger. As you can see, it's more complex. God places knowledge all around us, we will discover when we really want to,when we search,when we are open enough to see and understand. So now I point. I do not want people to follow me but to make their own journey. You are intelligent!! If you really want to find God, I bet you can find a way. How do I know I'm not talking just to myself. God doesn't think like me. My view is much too narrow. It's something I try to work on everyday. There are other things as well. If you find God, I promise you that you will know it!! We are ants. Hope this helps. Your comments are always welcome. If you decide not to look for God, God still loves you unconditionally!!!

Knowledge does not solve all problems. Knowledge only gives certain information and is helpful to a certain extent, but solving a problem is a different category. When we go beyond mind, there is a much larger of solving problems.

God has a very high IQ.''''.

Good for him. But that does not benefit me in any way. The question is whether I have got a good IQ or not. What I am going to do with God's high IQ?

Added to that people see only what they want to see,'''''

Not me. I can see things as they are.

Your post only shows you have got a closed view. You have jumped to a conclusion that God exists, just as somebody else jumps to a conclusion that God does not exist.

Whereas we agnostics, not knowing either way, don't jump to either conclusion. I must admit I get almost as peeved by blind atheism as I do by blind faith in God and scriptures. No atheist has ever been able to convince me that a higher power doesn't exist, just as no believer has ever convinced me it does.

Lash

Fredrick, knowledge does solve all problems because then you know just what to do to solve it. God's high IQ means thinking is required and then you might not understand. You say you are open to what is and yet you don't journey to discover the truth. You want all the answers to come to you. If God gave everyone all the answers, we would not have wisdom. God does not give me all the answers. I too must journey and search. Everyone wants God to make everything heaven all the time. How can you really learn???? What's in it for you???? Wisdom and knowledge.....Grandpa.Good answer. You are at least open to the possibilities. Why is it there is no real hunger for truth? Aren't you just waiting for the answers to come to you as well??? Hey! Great bunch of comments. Thank you both!!!

For your information, life is much more than just gaining knowledge. There is many a problem that has no solution. We have to accept such problems and change our attitudes. Knowledge has its importance; I did not say no. Thinking is useful, no doubt; but one should also learn to stop thinking. Too much of thinking makes mind noisy and a noisy mind will only add to the problems already existent.

In order to make a journey, one should know where to go. One should know where the destination is. To say 'journey towards the truth' is an absurd statement.

In this post, you have neither shared your experience, if you have got one. Neither do you tell anybody any guideline or direction. Just like I come across a treasure of millions of diamonds and emeralds and if I tell people I have found a big treasure and I do not tell anybody the direction, nobody would take me seriously.

You have not yet completed your journey and you have come to the conclusion that God definitely exists? If that is not a closed view, then what is? It is just like coming to conclusion that a particular dish is tasty without even eating the dish.

Ok. Start on your journey. God's handy work is all around this world. Try to understand and maybe you will start to see God. Example: All the physics of this world add up perfectly. If all the physics add up perfectly so must the people factor. If you can discover just how the people factor adds up then maybe you will start to understand God. With new ideas comes more ideas. Instead of working to prove God does not exist, try to figure out just what is going on. You are so dead sure God does not exist that you look for nothing. It is easier to do nothing but not near as much fun as discovery.

Do you think anybody would take your posts seriously?

I never said that I am sure about God's non-existence.

What is fun for one person may not be fun for another. One who considers his fun to be for all others is definitely narrow-minded.

For your information, God is a hypothesis; not necessarily a fact.

Beware of the mind. The mind causes hallucinations. You could mistake your next door neighbour for Santa Claus just as you could mistake somebody else for God.

Instead of searching for God, I would spend that time to make this world a better place, to help the needy and worried, to guide those who are depressed. If I searched for God, what the hell would I do with him?

It is far better to help others, do good to others. To go in search of imaginary characters is nothing but a waste of time.

To tell to search for God those who may not want to search is nothing but arrogance. Others have their free will. If somebody feels there is no God, what is your problem?

One more thing is: You speak as if you are dead sure that God exists. And you yourself said that you have not yet completed your search which only means you cannot come to a definite conclusion. Since you have come to a definite conclusion, how does it make you any more open-minded than atheist? You are as narrow-minded as atheists.

I have read plenty of spiritual books. Evry author shares his experience and offers guidelines to reach where he or she ah reached.

But you have nothing to share, nothing to offer. Just shows how hollow your talk is.

I know God exists the same way that I now know you exist. I realize that you are hurt by so much around this world and God. I do not command anyone to do anything. All your choices in life are yours. Freedom is yours. What I speak is the truth. I have made suggestions which you refuse to hear. Life changes people. Later you might see things differently. God is not a belief to me but a fact. But you know, there is always more to learn in this world. Sometimes I think I'm not learning fast enough. All things do come in their time. Sometimes we have to be ready for it. Thanks for all your comments!!

You cannot compare my existence to God's because no man can deny my existence unless he is a retard.

I have not been hurt. See how you jump to conclusions.

Of course, what you speak may be the truth. But somebody else can say contradicory and say waht he speaks is the truth. Since, neither of you can prove anything, your statemnets can only be considred by others as hypothesis.

That is why each must take their own journey. I can point but each must do the walking. Thanks for all your comments!!

You are closer to God than you realize. God is teaching us all to love unconditionally. When we acquire true wisdom, we realize that unconditional love is the only answer!!! GREAT COMMENTS!!!

Did you even read that quote? He is stressing the fact that NO RELIGION AND NO GOD IS NECESSARY. And this is a man who is the spiritual leader of an entire religion.

matsulori, no, he doesn't appear to read posts, or if he does, to understand them. As someone said above, it's pointless arguing with him - he suffers from blind arrogance.

Lash

Am I the one who is blind???? I belong to no religion. God doesn't either. Go back and read again. It will make sense if you don't try to bend it to your wills.

I'm say this slowly one more time and then I'm done: I'm not saying that god doesn't exist. What I'm saying is even IF he exists, he is NOT NECESSARY to lead an ethical, moral, good, and happy, fulfilled life, one just as fulfilled as one who chose to have god in their lives. I can't say this any more plainly.
If you can't concede that point, then you do not possess the open mind you set such store to.

Lash, I trying to be patient and polite, and to continue to have hope. Love and compassion and all that, you know:D .

Love to read your responses.

Ah yes, but I'm too cantankerous to bother with polite these days unless politeness is deserved. I also enjoy your responses, and by the way, are you not collecting friends at the moment (nudge nudge)? I like to be able to keep up with interesting posters, and the Friends Started list is the simplest way to do that.

Lash

*blushes* Thanks, Lash.

Hey! I sent you one already!

I have no idea what happened to the one you sent me, but I also sent you one which is still there, and that's what prompted the nudge lol.

Lash

Believing in God is not necessary. Believing has never been what it is all about!!!

Bird...it appears that they are not reading all your posts either. You have said more than once, God doesn't care if you don't believe...he still loves them anyway.

God is NOT NECESSARY; therefore, I could care less whether he "loves" me or not, unconditionally or not.

Bird, if believing has NEVER been what's he's all about, then enlighten me please: what HAS been ALL he's about. We can agree it hasn't been true enlightenment, or the bible wouldn't say everything revolves around the earth; it can't be love, because look what's been done not only in his name, but under his "own words" the bible -- and compassion goes right out the window with love; it can't be equality, because look how women are treated in the bible. You are no more privy to god's thoughts than a jackass. And if I can be proven to be wrong, I'll eat my prosthesis.

Thanks sweetchariot. They can't be reading it all. Thanks for dropping by. matsulori,Did I say God depends on a holy book that everyone does not have??? For one who does not believe in God, why do you base God on it???? Check out my next discussion. Step right up! tell me which one is God. Maybe some answers are there.

I look forward to it, Bird.

Much better put than this cantankerous old coot managed lol. That demand to listen to him really peeved me.

Lash

With the diversity of every individual, one can not put a label on any group and be accurate. The focus here is to light up the hurt. If one hides hurt and hold onto it,it will touch everyone you contact.All aren't hurting but I bet there are some. I am placing truth out there. I make no demands other than for people to think. As far as religion goes, I have seen a lot of man's problems in it. Everybody truly does want to rule the world. Religion can be brainwashing. People accept blindly. I know this too is a lesson to learn. At what point can anyone justify that thinking is not necessary. THe reasons I chose to look for God was to know the truth. You have to also realize the potential for learning that comes with God. I want no followers. Be who you must! It's a part of the plan!! Listen to the advice of others but walk your own path!!! Life's lessons are best learned that way!!! We learn through the parameters of our life and the interaction with people. I AM INTERACTING!!!!! You must admit. There is some thinking going on here!!!! Thanks for all the wonderful comments!!!!!!

"I am placing truth out there."

Is that so? Can you prove it?

Isn't that your job???

Yes, I search for truth. But that's my business, and between me and my Goddess, and none of your affair. When I screw if, she lets me know. You have nothing to do with that. But unlike you, I don't expect anyone to accept my truth after I implore them to search for truth. What I tell people is to study many religions -- all of them you can find, if religion is what you're looking for, and find what's resonates with you. I also urge study of history, archaeology, ancient Egypt, Greek mythology, the bible, and many other holy texts. I have read on paganism in general and wicca in specific. But I'm on my own path. I don't appreciate someone else with the arrogance to demand of me more than what I'm prepared to do. You don't know how observant I am; how much of my reading I dedicate to the pursuit of knowledge specifically on spiritual studies.

May I put forth a possibility: maybe it's not necessarily what you say but how you say it that is coming across so abrasively with so many? I offer this as a constructive criticism.

And no, that's your job; to prove what you say is true.

Angry? Hurt?? Am I demanding anything of anyone????? I have made some suggestions but no demands. You say it's my job to prove??? Doesn't God place knowledge all around us. It is up to the one who searches for knowledge to find the proof. I am merely placing it out to be seen. As far as the way I write, you are right in some of that. I am not a poet. Just placing it all out there can step on some toes. forgive me. Perhaps, more lessons for me to learn. Thanks for the comments!!

Yes! That they think and open themselves to "god" or your concept of god and that is a very narrow bias to hold people to. Do you not see that?

God places NOTHING around us. Man, evolution, and a myriad other things place things around us, but not god. If he has placed one -- just ONE thing that you can PROVE he has placed, I'm all ears.

Am I holding you to anything????? As far as proof of God, how can I show you proof if you refuse to walk to that proof. Go read my next discussion. Step right up! tell me which is God. Maybe it will clear.