Why can't Republicans be civil?

@trruk1 (1031)
United States
November 7, 2010 10:01am CST
People have always had differing views about political institutions, policies, and programs. They always will. But someone who has a different perspective from yours is not necessarily an evil person. Those on the right today seem to feel compelled to demonize anyone who does not swallow their entire program. Opponents are called socialists and a variety of other terms. Why? Why do they constantly heap abuse on those with different opinions? The discourse, in public discussions and political ads, is really ugly. And virtually all of it comes from the right. It is widespread on this site. The visceral hatred coming from self-styled "conservatives" is appalling and puzzling. I do not hate them but they sure seem to hate me. Maybe it is the result of their own fear and confusion. They cannot explain in any clear, coherent fashion why tax cuts for very wealthy people benefit the middle class, nor do they have any evidence to back it up, so their only option when they are questioned is to lash out at the questioner. I think people should be able to disagree on things and still get along. but for those on the right it does not appear to be possible. If you are not one of them, you must be evil and should be treated as such.
1 person likes this
9 responses
@mattic (282)
• United States
7 Nov 10
I have yet to hear a leftist give a clear concise reason why an individual should not be allowed to keep what they have earned, but must be forced by government to share it with those who did nothing.
1 person likes this
@trruk1 (1031)
• United States
7 Nov 10
Sure. Keep what you have earned. Keep all of it. But then you must not receive any of the benefits provided by those who pay taxes. You cannot go to a public school. If your house catches fire, it is your problem. If you get robbed, do not call the police because they will not come. you are not allowed to drive on public streets not walk on a sidewalk unless you built it yourself. If an army from another nation crosses the border, you are on your own.
1 person likes this
@mattic (282)
• United States
7 Nov 10
So, everyone receiving a tax "credit" should expect none of the same services? Your argument fails in that the fire and police are local, not federal issues. The military is the only legitimate function of the federal government in the examples you give. I am for cutting that to simply state run militias as well. As to government schools, that is neither the function nor duty of the federal government. In fact, government run education is the greatest example of government waste one can find. The cost per pupil has exploded, while the results are steadily declining. Thanks for making my point.
1 person likes this
@Latrivia (2889)
• United States
7 Nov 10
You get a lot of hatred from both sides. Some people on the right view leftists poorly, and some people on the left view the right the same. I know this because I'm conservative on some issues and liberal on others. I've lost count of the times I've been attacked by liberals and conservatives for disagreeing with them. On the other hand, there are still a fair number of liberals and conservatives that are interested in discourse - they're just not given the spot light. People would rather look for the crazies on either side because they're looking to discredit their opponents. Accusing the right of being uncivil while virtually ignoring the hostility the left puts out is pretty much doing exactly what you're accusing conservatives of. Instead of generalizing people, how about we talk about issues? Is that too difficult for people these days?
1 person likes this
@trruk1 (1031)
• United States
7 Nov 10
Lavinia, I have heard that asserted many times--"there is so much hatred pouring out from both sides". It just isn't true. there are a few mean-spirited people out there who claim some leftist perspectives, but only a few. I watch the news and read a lot, and the hatred and invective from the left is almost nonexistent. The Republican Party appears to be dominated by hatred of everybody else. The idea that both sides are to blame, so it is not productive to point fingers at one side simply does not hold water. As far as talking about issues, that is what I have tried to do. The responses have been rude and abusive and overwhelmingly personal. Which brings me back to the original question: why is so much hatred coming from the right? Even there were an equal amount of venom coming from the other side (and there is not) it would not make it okay. If Billy takes money from employer, it in no way excuses him to point out that Mary does it, too. It is just trying to change the subject.
@Latrivia (2889)
• United States
7 Nov 10
Tell you what, go on to a predominately left-winged website and attempt to discuss cutting welfare benefits and your disappointments with Obama, and come back and tell me how nice those liberals were. I've done it, and then watched as all but a few left-leaning individuals who felt the need to disagree with me attempt to tear me down on a personal level. I'm not defending partisan hostility, but I can guarantee you there are more than just a few liberals out there that are just as bad. Perhaps the reason you haven't run into them is because you're either lucky, or (judging from some of your posting history) you tend to agree with them, so there's no need for them to try and tear you down. "I watch the news and read a lot, and the hatred and invective from the left is almost nonexistent."
1 person likes this
@xfahctor (14128)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
7 Nov 10
I read through this whole discussion before replying. Wow! are you really that myopic? Do you honestly believe it is that one sided? Are you intentionally ignoring the vile things being said on the left as well or have you genuinely never been exposed to it? If the latter is true and you have truly never seen it, that can be easily remedied. If you simply refuse to see it, well, there is no helping that and no amount of links to examples are going to help. I have a serious question for you though. Do you believe calling someone a socialist is an insult?
@trruk1 (1031)
• United States
7 Nov 10
If calling someone a socialist is intended as an insult, then of course it is. If you had really read the whole discussion, you would not have written what you did. So (sigh) I will say it again. First of all, the overwhelming mass of hate speech comes from the right. Second, even if an equal amount of vitriol came from the left, that is irrelevant. The question was why is there so much hatred coming from the right. Saying there is hatred expressed by other people, too, is just irrelevant. Bad behavior cannot be justified by pointing a finger at somebody else and saying he does it, too. The next time you claim you have read the entire discussion, please actually do that first.
@xfahctor (14128)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
7 Nov 10
No, i read quite accurately and you just reaffirmed for me that you are in fact being myopic about it and that you do see it as that one sided. I say that because you said, and I quote: "First of all, the overwhelming mass of hate speech comes from the right" But i am also bewildered by this statement of yours: "Second, even if an equal amount of vitriol came from the left, that is irrelevant." And this one: "Saying there is hatred expressed by other people, too, is just irrelevant" How is it irrelevant? It isn't an "if", it is an "is". And to answer your direct question, you must also look at why it comes from the left as well, because the reasons, at their very basic, are the same. answer one question and you answer the other, they are not mutually exclusive. On the other issue..."If calling someone a socialist is intended as an insult, then of course it is." Calling someone a socialist is no more insulting than calling someone a capitalist. It may be inaccurate, depending on who you call a socialist, but it isn't an insult. It is nothing more than a description of someone's preferred economic governance model.
@xfahctor (14128)
• Lancaster, New Hampshire
8 Nov 10
Taskr, you parliamentarian!
@matersfish (6311)
• United States
7 Nov 10
Some people on the right are idiots. But you present it as if the lunacy is completely one-sided. There seems to be this rather large presumption with some on the left that their vitriol and their attempts at character assassinaton and their fierce pigeonholing of entire groups is not only justified but required. In the past three days on myLot, I've been told there were no Hitler comparisons coming from the left (specifically the Stewart rally), that the left doesn't do it as much, so it doesn't register the same, and that, because they're "right" in doing it, it doesn't even matter. Ironically enough, the overwhelming majority of right-leaning people I find on myLot are always quick to chastise bad behavior on the right wing and are quick to try to separate themselves from that type of behavior. I can't say I see the same from as many left-leaning myLot members. Some do. And I give them credit for it. But most seem to ignore or excuse it. Who are these people you speak of and where are their discussions? You're obviously seeing a totally different myLot than I am. I know of two "conservative" posters here continuously getting a bit nasty. Where is it elsewhere? "Socialist" aside, as that's just laughable, who are these nasty people and where can I find them to throw apples? Are they the few idiots holding up stupid signs? No, let me guess - FOX NEWS!!!!
@trruk1 (1031)
• United States
7 Nov 10
You are trying to excuse a lot of very bad behavior by claiming somebody else does it, too. That is no excuse. And if you do not see the hatred pouring out every from people who call themselves "conservative", I don't know what to tell you. It is on television. It is in the newspapers. It is in magazines. It is on the Internet. It is all over this site. A lot of it has been directed at me, personally. Which brings us back around to the question: why is so much hatred coming from the right? Even if it were true that an equal amount comes from the left, that is irrelevant.
• United States
7 Nov 10
Wise up. My first sentence shows clearly that I am in NO WAY excusing any bad behavior. Should I stoop even lower by calling an idiot worse than an idiot? And I obviously cannot answer your question since I have no examples from you other than you saying "I see it." Perhaps you're only looking for people to agree with you anyway in saying the "right" is nothing but hate. Which, if that's the case, I certainly do agree to an extent, with the fringe morons - emphasis on my calling those types of people idiots. Beyond that is just beyond that. For all I know, you're ubersensitive and someone simply disagreeing with you or your worldview qualifies as hatred. Perhaps my saying "wise up" is something you'll consider hatred and then lump me in with an entire group of people whom you've so nonchalantly stereotyped. "Even if it were true that an equal amount comes from the left, that is irrelevant." But that says it all.
@mattic (282)
• United States
9 Nov 10
You have been presented with example after example of the hatred spewed by the left, yet you have presented exactly ZERO examples in support of your claim of "visceral hatred" coming from the right.
@trruk1 (1031)
• United States
9 Nov 10
Read the discussion title. Read the discussion title. Read the discussion title. Read the discussion title. This question was not incivility from all directions. It was specifically a question about the behavior of Republicans. I have not a single, coherent answer. Maybe you can clear it up for me. But first, read the discussion title.
@mattic (282)
• United States
9 Nov 10
Republicans are civil, republicans are civil, republicans are civil. Your premise is blatantly false.
@mattic (282)
• United States
8 Nov 10
How's this for civil? Bernadine Dorhn, wife of Barack Obama's dear friend (and possible ghost writer) Bill Ayers, said this about the Tea Party, "It's racist, it's armed, it's hostile, it's unspeakable. White people armed, demanding an end to this president - it's very crazy-producing." Of course, her sanity may be called to question by additional statements she made such as calling the suggestion she was terrorist a "caricature...built on a complete lie." So much for "just a couple in the neighborhood". I guess when you live in Mr.Barry's neighborhood, this is what you get.
@trruk1 (1031)
• United States
8 Nov 10
go back and read the beginning of this discussion. At least read the title. You can read, can't you? Your comment is irrelevant and useless. Place it somewhere else. Read the title of the discussion. Read the title of the discussion. It is like I asked for some feedback on how to properly use an 18-speed transmission and you responded with an exposition on bicycles. Read the title of the discussion.
@mattic (282)
• United States
9 Nov 10
So when the vitriol of leftists like Dorhn is exposed, you say it is irrelevant. I would call it intellectual disohonesty, but that would give too much credit.
@Taskr36 (13925)
• United States
7 Nov 10
Liberals being civil - Yup, nothing hateful about portraying a Jewish congressman as Hitler at a Rally to Restore Sanity
"The visceral hatred coming from self-styled "conservatives" is appalling and puzzling." Yeah, and self-style "liberals" calling on Sarah Palin to be gang-raped isn't visceral hatred in the slightest I suppose. Give me a freaking break. There is plenty of hatred on both sides, but ignoring the disgusting hatred from the left, especially that directed at women and minorities, is disingenuous at best. There needs to be civility on BOTH sides. If you want to see hatred, look no further than the scum who showed up to John Stewart's "Rally to Restore Sanity". I'm not talking about Stewart or Colbert, but rather those loving and tolerant liberals who attended with signs portraying conservatives, including a Jewish congressman, as Hitler.
@trruk1 (1031)
• United States
7 Nov 10
Who called on Sarah Palin to be gang-raped? I haven't heard about that. the venom and hatred is nearly all coming from the right. It is in the news every day. It is on this site every day. And to say "Well, he does it, too", even if it were true, is no excuse at all. It is an attempt to point the finger at somebody else and therefore excuse somehow very bad behavior.
@Taskr36 (13925)
• United States
7 Nov 10
"Who called on Sarah Palin to be gang-raped?" That would be Sandra Bernhard. Her liberal audience loved it too. I could also point out how David Letterman though it was fine to make a joke about Palin's teenage daughter getting "knocked up by Anthony Rodriguez" on the highlight reels of a baseball game. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/10/02/sandra-bernhard-denies-re_n_131326.html "And to say "Well, he does it, too", even if it were true, is no excuse at all" I'm not making excuses for anything. If you'd read my post you'd see quite clearly that I said "There needs to be civility on BOTH sides." Attacking one side while ignoring the other does nothing to fix the problem and that's exactly what you're doing. You're taking sides holding only Republicans accountable while happily ignoring the hate and vitriol from the left. Keep in mind the images I'm posting were from less than a week ago at John Stewart's rally. If you'd like I could gladly show you photos from rallies where liberals were calling on people to KILL Bush and Cheney.
@RamJey (89)
• Singapore
7 Nov 10
This is a an execellent topic! I couldn't agree more. I believe the Republicans are leading the path to the downfall of the US. They cannot for once let a man lead America out of it's self-inflicted miseries. I believe they do not have the interest of the people at heart. Their only interests is the Republican party and to ensure it stays in power. My sincere wish is for someone in the Republican party to wise up to the situation and garner Republican support for the President
@trruk1 (1031)
• United States
7 Nov 10
I differ with the Republicans on a lot of things. Basically, I think the main function of government is to serve citizens. They think government exists to protect corporations. I still don't see why that difference of opinion should stir up so much hatred from them.
• United States
8 Nov 10
It's not corporations, it's jobs, and not wanting job loss.. also some dems are arrogant and rude just are some repubs and I daresay this is true of any group of imperfect humans (who also have a tendency to stereotype and to mishear the other side, or rather choose to hear what their side says about the other side).
@irishidid (8535)
• United States
8 Nov 10
I just wish the crazy people would decide which side they are on and stay there so I would know for sure which side I want to be on. For awhile the crazies were republican and now they are democrat. For now, I'll just keep a safe distance from both.